4l80e Teardown Rebuild and Installation

4L80E TEARDOWN REBUILD and INSTALLATION Thread Tools Search this Thread

01-24-2012, 06:29 PM #1

black00ssFL

TECH Resident

1998 Chevrolet Camaro

Trader Rating: 24Join Date: Oct 2006

Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

And my 4L80E swap begins

Well, to give a background of my story, here's a link to my thread I made when I blew my engine back in November of 2010.

Bittersweet night at gville raceway, updated dyno results on new engine

To make it short, I blew my stock ls1. Then, after it sitting for a few months I decided to pick up a shortblock on craigslist. After getting it in I found out it had a spun rod bearing. After taking it to the machine shop and getting a quote on fixing that, I got a great deal on an LQ4 shortblock. I added milled heads and a cam and have been running that for awhile now. I then found out I bent the 31 spline strange axles I had launching at 6000 rpms. After finally getting a new set from strange, I decided that sticking with an M6 would be costly. So I sold my t56 setup and am now piecing together a 4L80E setup.

The purpose of this thread is to give a play by play of my experience in this swap. There's a few writeups on tech for the swap, but I haven't seen but a few that are geared toward the budget minded of us. I'm gonna try to do this as cheaply as possible, but still having a reliable setup. I'll keep a running tally on this thread of my actual costs for EVERYTHING involved, so those out there wanting to know what it'll take to do this with a budget will have some sort of reference to go by. I'll keep updating the original post when I make new purchases and post the cost.

4L80E $200ATSG rebuild manual $26.88 Flexplate and Spacer $55HPTuners $499MWC 4l80e crossmember $160Jake's transbrake $450RevMax Stage 5 Converter $760making it work with '98 computer $20Used Direct Drum $9034 element sprag $46New reverse band $29.75various gaskets/seals $53.82Shifter switch plug $40.27Th400 Slip yoke $50Tranny coolers $50Madman dipstick $85Misc. wiring supplies $45Powder coat case $125Hose/clamps for cooler $5014 quarts fluid $65

I'll be going with a stock 4l80e (or rebuilding stock one myself). If it needs a rebuild, I'll attempt it myself and picking up a ATSG manual off of Ebay to help along the way. I'll be using a transbrake setup from Jake. I'll be tuning with HP tuners using my '98 pcm and wiring help from Slow67. For the converter, I'm leaning towards getting a non billet lockup from Revmax more than likely to help with cost and the fact I'll only push around 550whp if I go with nitrous. I'll be using a custom crossmember from MWC. I'll be getting a used flexplate and spacer. And probably pick up a lokar dipstick.

Today I picked up a 4L80E local that I found on Craigslist. I got it for a whopping $200! It's supposedly a '92 and came from a van. But, it has a full slip yoke (not the bolt on), and has been rebuilt (so probably has new wiring). It is missing a few pump bolts that they "borrowed" for another transmission. It was supposedly running fine when pulled. However, I'll be taking a look at things once I open it up when I install Jake's transbrake. Here are some pics.

As I bought her

getting ready for some cleaning

after cleaning

slip on yoke ftw!

__________________

1998 Camaro Z28 4L80E Sold

Last edited by black00ssFL; 03-27-2012 at 07:21 PM..

01-24-2012, 10:26 PM #2

DarkFox118

TECH Enthusiast

Garage is empty, add now

Trader Rating: 5Join Date: Jan 2011

Location: Douglasville, GA

Posts: 590

subscribing with a meaningless post.

I guess yours will be a bit different than mine in that you have a T56 now, I'll be going from a 60 to an 80, but still.. useful information incoming.

01-24-2012, 10:30 PM #3

RARON455

TECH Fanatic

1998 Pontiac Trans Am

Trader Rating: 35Join Date: Apr 2008

Location: Fort Worth Texas

Posts: 1,603

did this swap last year, didnt do a budget swap though, I spent alot of coin on the best trans and parts I could get.. If you run into a headache, PM me and I will do my best to help...

__________________1998 white T/A callies stuffed 383 (built by ME), prc heads, ported fast 92, EPS cam,morels,and the rest of the goodies,pushed by a QTP ford 9" Jakes performance 4l80 with transbrake and tcs billet converter.

Never save anything for a special day, THIS day the Lord has given IS special.

01-24-2012, 10:36 PM #4

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkFox118

subscribing with a meaningless post.

I guess yours will be a bit different than mine in that you have a T56 now, I'll be going from a 60 to an 80, but still.. useful information incoming. Hoping it will be useful to someone. If I do indeed rebuild this myself, plan on a lot of pictures and a novice writeup on it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RARON455

did this swap last year, didnt do a budget swap though, I spent alot of coin on the best trans and parts I could get.. If you run into a headache, PM me and I will do my best to help...

Thanks!

__________________


01-25-2012, 10:16 PM #5

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic


Trader Rating: 24Join Date: Feb 2006

Location: Pearland, Tx

Posts: 1,364

You will love it when its done. I know you already saw my thread so we will see who is in the swap cheaper, lol. Good luck

__________________02 T/A 408 l92 heads, nw 102mm. strange 12 bolt, 4l80, circle d 3600 gt91 turbo

Strange 4.10 12 bolt gear for sale pm me if interested.

01-26-2012, 02:19 PM #6

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cam72aro

You will love it when its done. I know you already saw my thread so we will see who is in the swap cheaper, lol. Good luck

Thanks! Yup, your thread help me decide that this could be done for almost the price I'm getting for my T56 setup. This could turn out to be a nice competition, lol.

Also just sent the money for 4L80E flexplate and spacer

__________________


01-30-2012, 01:29 PM #7

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Alright, did some ordering today. Picked up Hp Tuners from lethal racing ($499, plus $129 for wideband but you don't need the wideband for this swap), Jake's 4l80e transbrake setup ($450 shipped, tax time sale), MidWest Chassis 4L80e crossmember ($160 shipped, returning customer discount :-) ), and after talking to a few converter places I'm told my only real option with a transbrake and nitrous in the future is to go with a Billet setup. Ended up going with a RevMax Stage 5 Billet converter with 4,000 stall ($725) which will more than handle what I'll be doing.

Now I just need to figure out the wiring harness issue. There's a couple sponsors that sell m6->4l80e harness, but they're all $200 or so. Not quite wanting to spend that much for just a harness. Anyone know of anything cheaper?

__________________


01-31-2012, 05:52 PM #8

cabel1

11 Second Club


Trader Rating: 3Join Date: Sep 2007

Location: Wisconsin

Posts: 211

Get a stock auto harness. That's what I did

01-31-2012, 05:58 PM #9

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

The transmission came with the plug and a good amount of wire left on it. Just gonna get wires and pins and extend them myself and make my own harness.

__________________


01-31-2012, 06:15 PM #10

LongIsland63SS409

Launching!


Trader Rating: 9Join Date: May 2010

Location: Long Island, NY

Posts: 200

Nice post so far Thanks for sharing.Looking forward to your progress.

Mike

__________________www.lidragracing.com

01-31-2012, 11:43 PM #11

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

And I guess I can throw the "budget" aspect of my build out the window, lol. Going with the transbrake and the billet converter kinda did that. However, getting a standard "shift kit" (jake's valve body kit is only $110) and a non-billet converter ($300-450) can really take some costs out. I guess the actual cost of the transmission is the only thing left that's actually "budget" now.

__________________


02-02-2012, 06:29 PM #12

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Got the pedals in today. Also got the manual and jake's transbrake in the mail. Also got a nice surprise from jake too. He threw in some pump bolts I needed and a set of direct clutches (he knew I would be rebuilding this on my own and I asked him what are some common things that'll need to be replaced).

Rest of my week is busy, so it looks like I'll probably get to tearing the tranny down next week.

__________________


02-02-2012, 10:39 PM #13

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Here are pics of what i got today

__________________


02-03-2012, 12:48 AM #14

DarkhorSe_SS

TECH Fanatic



Location: Spurs City!!! SA, Tx

Posts: 1,350

GL man...

__________________GO SPURS GO...99, 03, 05, 07 CHAMPS

02-03-2012, 08:13 AM #15

DarkFox118

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 590

You're gonna do the rebuild yourself?

wow.. I've only been inside a 60E one time (indirectly at that.. I was watching a guy rebuild one..) I have even less idea how it works in there than I did before I saw him work on it.

Good luck man! Really tho.. for $200, it's worth a learning experience. Though I doubt you'll have any trouble with it..

__________________If you don't think I'm strange yet you don't know me well enough.

02-03-2012, 12:21 PM #16

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

A trans is simple if you keep the parts that come out in order. Take something out put it on the left side of the table then work to the right. Keep assemblies together until you are ready to work on it. Then finish it and go to the next. Take pictures etc. I have never been into an 80, but have done th400's 350's glides, 60's etc. I will eventually do my 80 when the time comes. Good luck op.



02-03-2012, 03:55 PM #17

LongIsland63SS409

Launching!




Posts: 200

Quote:


A trans is simple if you keep the parts that come out in order. Take something out put it on the left side of the table then work to the right. Keep assemblies together until you are ready to work on it. Then finish it and go to the next. Take pictures etc. I have never been into an 80, but have done th400's 350's glides, 60's etc. I will eventually do my 80 when the time comes. Good luck op.

Exactly breakdown into sub assemblies.When you get stuck, post and the knowledge on this site will get you thru it.

Mike


02-04-2012, 12:00 AM #18

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

So canceled class + wife hanging out with a friend tonight = me tearing down the 4L80E. Like promised, I took pics of the whole process. I must say though, for $200 I got this thing at a steal. Everything looks great and the clutches look like they were barely used. I haven't gone into the direct drum yet to see what kinda sprag I have. It was much more simple than I thought it would be. The main thing is to stay organized and label things as you go. Anyways, on to the pics/procedure for dis assembly.

First of all I highly recommend this manual. The pics and diagrams made taking this thing apart a breeze.

First I removed the extension case

Then I removed the VSS sensors

Then I removed the pan

Then the filter

Then I removed the wiring harness

Then I removed the pressure switch manifold that's on the valve body

Then I removed all the valve body bolts (21 of them), along with the oil stop, manual lever detent spring, lube pipe, and wiring clips.

Then I removed the valve body and the gasket. This is where some patience may help. My gasket was really brittle and I ended up having to take out the trusty razor blade to scrape most of it off. I'll have to clean the rest of it up later on when I clean the case.

Next up was to take out the check balls, there's 8 of them and it's really obvious where they go.

__________________


02-04-2012, 12:01 AM #19

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Next up I removed the TCC/PWM solenoid screen and the intermediate servo assembly. I simply pulled the screen out with some small needle nose pliers. And the servo is simply pulled out.

Next was the reverse servo assembly

Then I removed the parking pawl bracket

Finally, to finish out the valve body area, I removed the 4th clutch housing bolt (40 torx bit) and the center support bolt (3/8" 12 point).

Now on to removing the "guts" of the tranny. Next up I removed the O ring from the turbine shaft and the pump bolts

Then I pulled out the pump. I used two medium size pry bars at opposite ends to give it a little help out of the casing. Once it was free, I pulled it out by hand. Be sure not to pull the turbine shaft. Make sure you get the thrust washer, and throw out the gasket.

Next I pulled out the overdrive carrier/turbine shaft/overrun clutch housing assembly. There's a thrust bearing behind it as well

Then I pulled out the 4th clutch housing/assembly

__________________


02-04-2012, 12:02 AM #20

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Next up was pulling the forward clutch housing

Then I pulled the direct clutch housing and the intermediate band

Next up I removed the intermediate clutches. I had to remove the snap ring by using a long flat head screwdriver, and simply pulled out the clutches.

Then it was on to the center support assembly/gear train unit. Again, I used a long flat head to get the snap ring out. then I had to pull it out by only pulling on the very tip of the splined shaft with one hand while supporting it with the other. If you pull it out by grabbing farther back, the assembly won't come out whole. There's also a thrust washer at the back of this assembly.

Next up there is a case spacer that needs to be removed. It's just like the snap rings, but sitting in there a little looser.

__________________


Page 1 of 9

123>Las

Thread Tools Search this Thread

02-04-2012, 12:03 AM #21

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Finally I removed the reverse band assembly.

And there you go, an empty case!

I still had a little time so I went ahead took out the clutches from the direct, forward, and 4th housings. They are held in by snap rings that I removed with a screw driver and simply pulled the clutches out. All the clutches and plates look in really good condition, as if this thing just had a recent rebuild!

__________________


02-04-2012, 02:32 AM #22

eLiT3SnIpEz

TECH Enthusiast



Location: Haltom City, TX

Posts: 621

Great thread man! Word of advice for future reference, removing the parking pawl is not necessary, it's perfectly fine to just keep it in there, it's much less of a hassle that way.

Also, for removing the pump, instead of having to use two pry bars on both sides of it to get it out it comes out quite easily with one pry bar if you use it behind the pump, by sticking it down in the case from behind. There's a little bit of a gap that's perfect for it. Look at the bottom of your picture, just a little down and to the right of that bottom oil pan bolt hole.

Please, please, please, don't call it a turbine shaft lol, I don't know why, but I just hate it when it's called that for some reason. It bugs me every time I read it like that

For the gasket shit that you used a razor blade on. One thing you can do if available to you is put in a really hot parts washer and let it do it's thing. That alone won't really take it off, but once you let it dry, it becomes much easier.

I recommend buying a pumice stone, 2-3 cans of brake cleaner, fine grit sandpaper and some rubber gloves. If you plan to paint the case to make it look really nice (which I would recommend just because) then clean it very well with brake cleaner and a wire scrubber. An air hose is VERY handy to have for that, but not necessary. Use brake cleaner and the pumice stone in nice, even, but firm, strokes on the case valve body. It smoothes the surface, and a practice used by professional transmission builders Once it's all nice and clean, let it wait for about a day, then paint that case, nice and evenly. Be careful with the inside of the bellhousing, and try not to get it inside the case.

Once the case is dry, take the sandpaper and sand around the edges of the case, and any excess paint that may be on there will come right off. The edges I'm referring to are like this

All around the edges where the oil pan gasket goes, then go up and do the front facing edges of the bellhousing and what not, know what I mean?

Once you've done that, BLOW THE FUCK OUT OF THAT CASE. If you can, or if you know someone who has a compressor, air hose the hell out of that case, inside and out. Be sure to spray brake cleaner in the inside as well and then blow stuff out of it. It may seem like some annoying prep work but you will have a spotless prepared case that would keep up with or outdo many professional builders. A lot of normal general transmission repair shops don't give a damn, some won't even change your seals on transmissions of yours that they're rebuilding. It's the little things that set it apart.

I also recommend using the brake cleaner on the pump and the valve body. Not sure how thorough your kit is for the rebuild, but it should come with new seals and bushings. Once you've taken your pump apart, use a chisel and a hammer (or a flat head and a hammer) and take the seal off the pump face. Since this is a budget build I assume you don't want to buy a seal puller lol. For removing and replacing the bushings, the only method I can recommend with confidence is buying (and then returning ) a bushing driver. Some people might tell you to use the hammer and chisel again to remove the bushing, I say avoid that because you risk damaging the pump bore.

If you don't know, this is a bushing driver kit Basically it's these little metal pieces that look like donuts with a lip on the out part of them. They come in different sizes depending on the bushing size, and the sizes are marked on each "donut". You can tell the proper size by seeing which one perfectly catches the lip of the old bushing and doesn't really give any play. Put the driver into the "donut" and hammer it out. Spray inside the bore with brake cleaner. Once it dries (should be pretty quick) carefully line up your new bushing and double check your driver size. Hammer it in, make sure that you don't go so far the lip of the bushing stick into the pump AT ALL. It would really suck hard if the pump gears caught onto the bushing lip. There's a slightly beveled edge on the inner face of the pump bore if you're looking at it with the inside facing up towards you. Make the bushing is even and is a hair lower than where the bevel ends. I can try to snag you a photo next week of what I mean.

Spray the insides of both of the pump halves and use the pumice stone on them again, same deal. Use the pumice stone on the valve body as well, the back side as well. Recommend using an air compressor if you can to clean it. Pretty much an air compressor is the best damn thing you can have to clean and dry transmission parts.

Once you've cleaned all of your parts, (do this as thoroughly as you can, gonna need more brake fluid cleaner since you don't have a cleaning area with chemicals and brushes and what not. Brake cleaner is VERY strong though and can do shit most transmission cleaner can't, so it's quite good. Once your parts are all cleaned, and your case is ready, I highly recommend stacking the transmission.

Basically, take a vice clamp and tightly secure your yoke. Build your transmission like that, starting with the output shaft, low ring gear, intermediate shaft, low gearset, snap right etc. Build it all the way up to the pump. It takes a little more time, but it does 2 things1) You have a better idea of how it's all going to go in the case and it's a nice little bit of practice2) It helps you look at everything and make sure you didn't leave something out, it's easy to forget something like a thrust washer or a bearing etc. Stacking ensures you got all of your shit straight before actually putting it in the case. Use plenty of Transgel and be careful seating the pistons! Don't chew up the lips! You might also want to buy a feeler gauge (they're dirt cheap, like a couple of bucks) to check your clutch pack clearances, among other things. You're also going to need to find a way to compress the springs that you pulled from things like the direct drum etc.

I can tell you those are damn near impossible to put back on without some kind of spring compressor. The big spring on the overdrive basket is put on by hand. I'm pretty tired at the moment, but I forgot to ask and I just suddenly wondered if you did or did not remove those springs? You should if you can, since you need to remove the piston to fully clean everything and replace seals. Be sure to keep track of all of your parts as best as you can, it sucks losing something, would suck worse losing something and you don't even know it.

There's probably more I could chime in, but this post is really really long and I'm really really tired, so I'll just let it be for now. Any questions, maybe I could answer, and if not I know someone else will be able to.

02-04-2012, 08:28 AM #23

LongIsland63SS409

Launching!




Posts: 200

Great progress and info!Thanks for sharing!

Mike


02-04-2012, 08:39 AM #24

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

A lot of good info there elite! I didn't remove the whole prawl, just the bracket. And yes a full cleaning of the case is in order. Luckily I just bought a case of brake cleaner last week when advance auto had a bogo free sale. And my shop has a 6hp/80 gallon compressor :-) .

Keeping the budget aspect in mind. I wasn't planning on a full rebuild unless I needed it. The main reason for opening it up was to instal the transbrake and check for obvious wear/damage. That being said, would it be necessary to replace the bushings if they are in good shape? I haven't bought a rebuild kit yet, as I was waiting to see the condition first. Would I be ok with just a basic kit that replaces just mostly the seals?

__________________


02-04-2012, 12:55 PM #25

eLiT3SnIpEz

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 621

Quote:

Originally Posted by black00ssFL

A lot of good info there elite! I didn't remove the whole prawl, just the bracket. And yes a full cleaning of the case is in order. Luckily I just bought a case of brake cleaner last week when advance auto had a bogo free sale. And my shop has a 6hp/80 gallon compressor :-) .

Keeping the budget aspect in mind. I wasn't planning on a full rebuild unless I needed it. The main reason for opening it up was to instal the transbrake and check for obvious wear/damage. That being said, would it be necessary to replace the bushings if they are in good shape? I haven't bought a rebuild kit yet, as I was waiting to see the condition first. Would I be ok with just a basic kit that replaces just mostly the seals?

Perfect! You are very well equipped to clean this bad boy 100%. Use the air blower on every thing! Word of advice again, when cleaning anything with planetaries (the little spinning gears), do not blow on the planetaries directly to the point that they start spinning EXTREMELY fast and they make a little high pitched whooshing sound.

It wouldn't be necessary but it can't hurt. A lot of rebuild kits will come with bushings, and if it were me, I'd buy a kit that has all new seals, clutch packs (highly recommended High Energy OEM packs, not Red Altos), new steels, bushings, and gaskets. It might be an extra couple hundred dollars but it is highly recommended, as this will extend the life of your transmission and enable it to hold more power than it could with the old stuff.

You said you bought Jake's Transbrake right? If so, you're going to need to do a few hydraulic modifications for it, which will also benefit your transmission. Read all this -> http://jakesperformance.com/4L80_T-b...struction.html

I know I know I know it sucks ass to go over what the budget originally intended and it may seem like paying more money for more hassle, but it really truly is worth knowing that your transmission will easily outlast your engine.

02-04-2012, 02:42 PM #26

White.Lightning

TECH Addict


Trader Rating: 52Join Date: Mar 2005

Location: Philadelphia, PA

Posts: 2,532

Great write up man! In for updates and to learn something.

I'll be doing an 80e swap later this year, but I am sourcing my trans from a builder.

Good luck!

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-04-2012, 04:29 PM #27

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

I'm really debating on just leaving this as is. Just do the modifications I need for the transbrake, putting in the new direct clutch pack, and just putting it back together. It really looks like this thing was gone through just before it was taken out of the vehicle it came from. I can snap pictures next time I'm out there and show everyone. The thrust bearings looked great and the clutches barely looked used with no hotspots.

Labor is not a problem for me. I have a "shop" with a couple friends where we have a tranny jack and lift. Wouldn't take but a couple hours to pull it out if I needed to do a proper rebuild. I know it'll be easier to do it now, but it looks fresh as is. I compare it to tearing down a 2,000 mile engine, but replacing everything in it since it's open anyways (I know that's not a direct comparison since there are parts/bolts that can't be reused during assembly).

__________________


02-04-2012, 04:54 PM #28

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Just found this little gem, http://mattw2.dyndns.org:81/pics/Clo...wTo/index.html

Nice little writeup on rebuilding it. I do have one question though. Looks like he was able to do everything without special tools, except for the 4th clutch lip seal installer. Is there a way to install the 4th piston and roller clutch without tearing up the seals?

__________________


02-05-2012, 08:58 AM #29

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

I've had this thread bookmarked for a while now:

http://helpwrench.com/forums/showthr...amp-pictures-1

Lots of info in there as well

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-06-2012, 09:11 PM #30

eLiT3SnIpEz

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 621

Quote:


Just found this little gem, http://mattw2.dyndns.org:81/pics/Clo...wTo/index.html

Nice little writeup on rebuilding it. I do have one question though. Looks like he was able to do everything without special tools, except for the 4th clutch lip seal installer. Is there a way to install the 4th piston and roller clutch without tearing up the seals?

You definitely don't need special tools. The only things I can think of right now are a special device to compress the springs on the direct drum and forward drum so you can take the snap ring off and put the snap ring back on. You do need a lip seal installer for the pistons. There is more than one piston that needs to be installed, all of them have seals. You MUST use some kind of lube, either transmission fluid or Trans-Gel, and use the lip seal installer to properly seat them. It can be tricky, especially for your first time and you can damage seals fairly easily if you're not careful. Always start with the lip seal installer on the inner seal of the piston, then outer.

Not sure what you mean about installing the low roller clutch without tearing up the seals. It just drops into place in the reaction carrier, very simple and no seals to worry about

I haven't read the whole guide but there are two things the guy does I highly do not recommend.

#1 Don't twist the pistons into place and "use the lip sealer tool if necessary" that's a good easy way to damage the seals, trust me. If it could be done like that, there would be no need for lip seal installers. The seals could easily catch on the walls of the drum and tear.

#2 Don't bother taking apart the springs, since I'm guessing you are not using the Transgo kit.

I notice he does a few things I differently, but that's on him I suppose. Definitely gives you a pretty good idea of what's what and what to do.

02-06-2012, 09:47 PM #31

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by eLiT3SnIpEz

You definitely don't need special tools. The only things I can think of right now are a special device to compress the springs on the direct drum and forward drum so you can take the snap ring off and put the snap ring back on. You do need a lip seal installer for the pistons. There is more than one piston that needs to be installed, all of them have seals. You MUST use some kind of lube, either transmission fluid or Trans-Gel, and use the lip seal installer to properly seat them. It can be tricky, especially for your first time and you can damage seals fairly easily if you're not careful. Always start with the lip seal installer on the inner seal of the piston, then outer.

Not sure what you mean about installing the low roller clutch without tearing up the seals. It just drops into place in the reaction carrier, very simple and no seals to worry about

I haven't read the whole guide but there are two things the guy does I highly do not recommend.

#1 Don't twist the pistons into place and "use the lip sealer tool if necessary" that's a good easy way to damage the seals, trust me. If it could be done like that, there would be no need for lip seal installers. The seals could easily catch on the walls of the drum and tear.

#2 Don't bother taking apart the springs, since I'm guessing you are not using the Transgo kit.

I notice he does a few things I differently, but that's on him I suppose. Definitely gives you a pretty good idea of what's what and what to do.

You're slowly but surely convincing me to do the whole rebuild myself, lol. I have an array of hand clamps (the type he used) and c clamps, so I think I can throw something together to compress the springs. And yes, no transgo kit, so no need to take apart the springs. It would be a simple seal and clutch replacement.

__________________


02-06-2012, 09:53 PM #32

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by White.Lightning

I've had this thread bookmarked for a while now:

http://helpwrench.com/forums/showthr...amp-pictures-1

Lots of info in there as well

Yup, that's in my bookmarks as well. That one is a little more common and has come up on a few searches that I've done on rebuilding these things. I just found the link I posted after doing some more in depth searching.

__________________


02-07-2012, 05:13 PM #33

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Ok, got a little work done today, got some parts in the mail, and found a problem.

First up, new parts! Got the flexplate, spacer, and bolts.

And...my Revmaxx converter

Got a couple hours to head up to the shop and do a little bit of work. Clean the inside of the case with some brake cleaner and compressed air.

Then I got to tearing down the direct drum. First up was to compress the springs. Like the link I posted above, I used some clamps to do this

With it compressed, I removed the snap ring and took off the spring assembly

Then I pulled out the piston

Then I turned the drum over to get to the sprag. I first removed the spiral lock ring. I did this by taking a small screwdriver, lining up the area that locks on the ring with one of the notches in the drum, and pulled up on it to unlock it.

Then I removed the retainer

Then I removed the sprag. I discovered that it is a 17 element sprag....so time to upgrade to a 34 element one!

Then I began inspecting the drum since I have to drill a hole in it for the transbrake. By doing so I discovered the reason this tranny was only $200. I saw a nice big crack!

I already called up Jake and got a used one on it's way for $90. I also talked to them about the interior condition of the tranny. They advised that if I think everything looks good, just replace what's need and bolt it back up. They did recommend a new reverse band, and I agree as it's a little worn. So I'm just gonna get a new reverse band, 34 element sprag, pump gasket, valve body gasket, replace the direct clutches with the ones Jake gave me, and a rear seal. After that I'm just gonna bolt it up.

__________________


02-07-2012, 05:20 PM #34

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Also, I'm stuck on a decision on what to do for the cooler. I got a couple offers in the air right now to buy some used coolers, then having to fab up my own lines and fittings for the tranny. Or, there's an all in one kit on Jeg's website that includes a nice B&M cooler and AN lines/fittings.http://www.jegs.com/i/B-M/130/70266K...rentProductId=

I'd probably spend about $75-100 on a used cooler, fittings, and hose to make it work, but it won't be AN lines like the kit above. I think it's almost worth the extra bucks just to have the nice cooling with the secure lines.

__________________


02-07-2012, 10:53 PM #35

eLiT3SnIpEz

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 621

Case looks super clean man! I was going to come in here and chime in that I would also recommend a 34 element sprag, but it looks like you already beat me to it! lol.

One thing to remember when putting the race back on the drum after you've installed the sprag, the race must NOT be able to turn counter clockwise. IT should only be able to spin clockwise. That mean you put the race on backwards, so if that happens just take it off and flip it over and try again

Again, be super careful with the piston installation! Can you see how the walls of that direct drum would just love to fuck with you and tear up your lip seals? Make sure your lip seals are facing the correct way as well!

02-08-2012, 10:55 AM #36

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Errgghhh. I'm still Torn on what to do about the cooler. I know the case is 1/4 NPS thread. However, there is a consensus that 1/4 NPT will work as long as you don't gorilla torque it down and crack the case. That being said, I can pick up a 11x6x1 1/2 B&M cooler and some hose for $30, then I'd just need some more hose, 1/4 NPT to barb fittings, and some hose clamps to make it work. That might be close to around $50. OR I can just get a kit like the one I posted above but spend about $170. I don't think the cost is worth it for the 1% chance I have that a cooler line could pop off. I'd double clamp the fittings as well. Any input from anyone?

__________________


02-08-2012, 11:08 AM #37

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

I'm going all out on my cooler.....

(1) 11x11 B&M bar/plate cooler w/ 1/2 NPT female connectionshttp://www.summitracing.com/parts/BMM-70274/(1) Flex-A-Lite 10" fanhttp://www.summitracing.com/parts/FLX-390/(2) 1/2 NPT to 6AN fittingshttp://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-220649/(4) 6AN hose endshttp://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-220690/(15') 6AN hosehttp://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-230615/(1) 4L80e rear trans cooler fitting- w/ 3/8 NPThttp://www.transmissionpartsusa.com/...-00046340a.htm(1) 6AN to 3/8NPT steel fitting, 90 degree, welded to above (after clocked)http://www.summitracing.com/parts/AER-FBM2620/(1) 4L80e front trans cooler fittinghttp://www.transmissionpartsusa.com/...-00035340b.htm(1) 6AN to 1/4NPT steel fitting, 90 or 45 degree (not sure yet), welded to abovehttp://www.summitracing.com/parts/FRA-582206/

So basically its a 6AN hose, converting to 1/2NPT at the cooler. The trans fittings apply to the later model 4L80's with the trans cooler holes further apart. The older style case has the trans cooler holes kind of right next to one another. When using the newer style case, you really need to fab this 90 degree fitting to have enough room. Some have tried to bend a steel tube and it makes me cringe. Looking at your pics, it appears you have the older style trans case and will not need to purchase those 90 degree steel fitting and weld them. You should just be able to grab a 2nd set of AN to NPT fittings to plug into the trans case.

If I'm spending all this money on a 4L80 conversion, might as well do the cooler right since it will keep the trans alive.

ETA: Mightymouse thought of the rear fitting idea a while ago....i finally found the perfect 4l80 rear fitting

And his build thread:my 4l80/yank/supercooler/m6 conversion__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

Last edited by White.Lightning; 02-08-2012 at 11:14 AM..

02-08-2012, 11:10 AM #38

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:


If I'm spending all this money on a 4L80 conversion, might as well do the cooler right since it will keep the trans alive.

This is the thought my mind keeps coming back to

__________________


02-08-2012, 11:16 AM #39

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

BTW, looking at your list, I think this will make life easier

http://www.sweetperformance.com/prod...&productId=496

That'll get rid of some of the complications of adapting the cooler fittings to AN lines.

__________________


02-08-2012, 11:18 AM #40

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

^^^^ Sweet! Thanks for the link. I just need to make sure a 90 degree hose end will have enough room to be installed.

ETA: A reliable source said there is NOT enough room to run those adapters and a 90 degree hose end. Oh well. Back to Mightymouse's proven method!

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

Page 2 of 9

Last


02-08-2012, 11:47 AM #41

JRENIGAR

TECH Resident


Trader Rating: 4Join Date: Dec 2010

Location: Wynne, ar

Posts: 843

Damn, you have been busy. I have built a couple of 60's before and they are quite a bit different on the inside from this 80 your doing. It looks much more heavy duty in the gears, clutches, and everywhere else. I wonder where the fine line is between the 60 and 80 for holding hp and what the weight between the two are? Does it use more hp to run than the 60? Sorry to hijack, now I will go ...__________________99 Z-28, A4, 3.23, Hooker Lt's,custom oryp, custom cb, ls6 intake, ported TB, Intercooled Vortech v9-g trim, Racetronix pump n harness, Siemens 60's, dyno tune, 450/438.

02-08-2012, 11:53 AM #42

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRENIGAR

Damn, you have been busy. I have built a couple of 60's before and they are quite a bit different on the inside from this 80 your doing. It looks much more heavy duty in the gears, clutches, and everywhere else. I wonder where the fine line is between the 60 and 80 for holding hp and what the weight between the two are? Does it use more hp to run than the 60? Sorry to hijack, now I will go .......waits for Jake or Slow67 to jump in....

But, the 80 is nothing like the 60. The 80 is based off the Th400 and many parts interchange. The actual weight difference according to Jake from Jake's transmission is about 30-40lbs dry and with no converter. Being that my 9.5" is not really different in weight than what would go in a 60, I can deal with that weight increase.

__________________


02-08-2012, 12:09 PM #43

DarkFox118

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 590

whats the comparison from a t56 to an 80? (assuming your weight comparison is from a 60 to an 80 that is..)

So it looks like for people going from ls1/60 to LQ/80 they'll be picking up about 120 pounds.. or 1 light passenger on their vehicle weight. Not bad really when you consider the abuse the 80 can take, and the budget power potential from an iron block lsx motor.

__________________If you don't think I'm strange yet you don't know me well enough.

02-08-2012, 12:36 PM #44

JRENIGAR

TECH Resident



Location: Wynne, ar

Posts: 843

Would an 80 from a 6.5 diesel engine work or would it have to be from a gasser? Reason Im asking is I can get the trans in working condition for $150-$200.

__________________99 Z-28, A4, 3.23, Hooker Lt's,custom oryp, custom cb, ls6 intake, ported TB, Intercooled Vortech v9-g trim, Racetronix pump n harness, Siemens 60's, dyno tune, 450/438.

02-08-2012, 12:38 PM #45

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Yes, you probably won't have the 12 o'clock bolt hole to bolt up to an LS engine. But that's not really an issue to worry about.

__________________


02-08-2012, 12:46 PM #46

JRENIGAR

TECH Resident



Location: Wynne, ar

Posts: 843

Sounds good, I just didnt want to buy a trans that wouldnt work as this would be for a future build. I havent needed to do any research on this issue but the opportunity just presented itself today. I probably have little time to act on it if ya know what I mean. Thanks...


02-08-2012, 01:01 PM #47

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

In general '91-up works as long as they're not from a Jaguar, lol. There's just little differences that need to address depending on which one.

__________________


02-08-2012, 09:11 PM #48

eLiT3SnIpEz

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 621

I cleaned and packaged up your drum for you today, and because I'm such a nice guy I even drilled the hole in the drum for you for the dual feeding process I'm looking forward to seeing this build progress!

The weight difference between the 60e and the 80e is about 35 pounds. Not sure what JRENIGAR means about the fine line between the two transmissions holding power.

02-08-2012, 09:24 PM #49

JRENIGAR

TECH Resident



Location: Wynne, ar

Posts: 843

Quote:




I was trying to say, If you have xxx hp and the 60 goes bye bye, should you invest in a 80 or just rebuild the 60 to hold said hp? Ok, will a modded 60 hold 600rwhp reliably or is say 525-550rwhp the majic # to where there isnt much more to do to keep the lil sucker from going out again? Would 550rwhp be a good # to invest in an 80 and all the extra work involved or can the 60 churn right along with no sweat at that hp? Damn, I almost think "Im" drunk, but Im not... Me words right now. Kids, "Just Say No"...


02-08-2012, 10:19 PM #50

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:




Sounds great!! Haha, didn't even put two and two together that you were the same guy I talked to on the phone yesterday. It makes sense with your knowledge of these transmissions, lol. I'll be sure to keep this going and updated every step of the way.

__________________


02-08-2012, 10:38 PM #51

Jake's Performance

LS1Tech Sponsor



Posts: 770

Quote:




The hole in the drum is a bleed to prevent centrifugal apply and speed transbrake release. It has nothing to do with dual feeding.

__________________GM Racing Automatics from the company that designs the parts, not just another parts assembler.www.jakesperformance.comRacing Automatic Transmission Tech www.race-trans-tech.com

02-09-2012, 12:28 AM #52

eLiT3SnIpEz

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 621

Quote:


Sounds great!! Haha, didn't even put two and two together that you were the same guy I talked to on the phone yesterday. It makes sense with your knowledge of these transmissions, lol. I'll be sure to keep this going and updated every step of the way.

lol nah man, that was Mike, our shop manager. He knows about 50 billion times more than me about transmissions, I'm fairly new myself to be honest, a greenhorn you could say. I mostly breakdown transmissions, ship stuff and do other general things while putting along with my training. An extreme crash course in transmission training that still takes many months if not years. As you know breakdown is the easy part, putting it back together and CORRECTLY, is the challenge. That's why I'm excited to see your thread go along, we're both kind of learning together. I figured I'd just throw my little pieces of tips and reminders to help you out there! Quote:

Originally Posted by Jake's Performance

The hole in the drum is a bleed to prevent centrifugal apply and speed transbrake release. It has nothing to do with dual feeding.

As you can see, boss man here helps me quite a bit along the way, and I have quite a long road ahead of me, despite all that I have learned. Couldn't ask for a better teacher though!

02-11-2012, 09:29 PM #53

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Was out at the shop for most of the day. Did a few transmission related things, but most of my time was spent cleaning up the undercarriage of the car (long story, but there's undercoating all under it that makes it look nasty. Anyways, started to make my own wiring harness using the plug that came with the tranny.

Then I tapped the passage to the reverse servo to put in a set screw per instructions for the transbrake

And finally I grinded the reverse servo pin a little as per the transbrake instructions.

Overall things are coming along. Been studying the wiring diagram I got from Slow67, the pcm pinout for a '98, and a plug diagram for the plug I have for the 4l80e. I'm pretty sure I have it figured out and labeled everything accordingly. I bought some pins from mouser electronics to attach the wiring to the PCM and will be finishing the harness up next chance I get.

__________________


02-12-2012, 09:50 AM #54

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

The only thing I would have done was upgrade to the later style plug. Otherwise it looks like you got it going your way. I drove mine to and from work yesterday. Put about 40 miles on it. I am getting the motor and trans tune slowly but surely to where I want it. I love being able to put the shifter in drive and it shift on its own. Its almost like my truck but with about 450 more hp, lol. You stomp it in 4th and it downshifts to 3rd and boost comes up and the car goes. I know I am on borrowed time with my junkyard 80, but when it starts slipping I will pull it apart and fix whats broken. Between this thread and the links its helpful information. Keep the info coming. Josh



02-12-2012, 09:54 AM #55

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

I agree about the plug, but didn't realize it was the later style until I started looking for the wiring/colors/location on the diagrams I have. But it is a budget build and it will work this way, lol.

__________________


02-12-2012, 10:00 AM #56

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

Budget my arse, lol. Mine is budget, but yours will be done right once.



02-12-2012, 10:02 AM #57

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:


Budget my arse, lol. Mine is budget, but yours will be done right once.

Haha, budget as in I'm not paying for a $3,000+ 4l80e and can almost do it for the price of the 6 speed parts I sold.

__________________


02-12-2012, 10:17 AM #58

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

Quote:


Haha, budget as in I'm not paying for a $3,000+ 4l80e and can almost do it for the price of the 6 speed parts I sold.

I gotcha. Mine was budget as in as cheap as I could do it.



02-12-2012, 10:21 AM #59

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:


I gotcha. Mine was budget as in as cheap as I could do it.

I was thinking of doing the same thing as you...but I kept thinking, lol. I wanted a shift kit and saw jakes VB kit. Then I saw his transbrake setup which includes the VB mods for not much more money. Then I decided I might wanna run nitrous. The combination of nitrous and the transbrake brought me out of the realm of a budget converter and had to go billet, lol. That's most of my build right there. For the cost of just the transbrake I could of had both a decent converter and the VB kit. But, it's a good thing I went with the transbrake, or I wouldn't have opened up the tranny and seen the cracked direct drum! At least I'm saving money on an actual rebuild and making my own wiring harness! __________________


02-12-2012, 10:48 AM #60

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

Quote:


I was thinking of doing the same thing as you...but I kept thinking, lol. I wanted a shift kit and saw jakes VB kit. Then I saw his transbrake setup which includes the VB mods for not much more money. Then I decided I might wanna run nitrous. The combination of nitrous and the transbrake brought me out of the realm of a budget converter and had to go billet, lol. That's most of my build right there. For the cost of just the transbrake I could of had both a decent converter and the VB kit. But, it's a good thing I went with the transbrake, or I wouldn't have opened up the tranny and seen the cracked direct drum! At least I'm saving money on an actual rebuild and making my own wiring harness! Things happen for a reason. It would have sucked to put it together and it not go into gear or be slipping. I am very lucky that mine works. Screw nitrous go procharger or turbo. I am considering selling my procharger eventually and going 91mm turbo. I guess I like working on this heap, lol.



Page 3 of 9

Last


02-12-2012, 12:57 PM #61

eLiT3SnIpEz

TECH Enthusiast




Posts: 621

Quote:


Things happen for a reason. It would have sucked to put it together and it not go into gear or be slipping. I am very lucky that mine works. Screw nitrous go procharger or turbo. I am considering selling my procharger eventually and going 91mm turbo. I guess I like working on this heap, lol.

Noooo! That Procharger is a huge reason why I'm such a fan of your car!

02-12-2012, 01:22 PM #62

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Nitrous is only for a quick fix while I'm in school. One of my buddy's in our shop has a generic wet kit he said I could use. Then after school I'll be going f/I. I really like that modular turbo kit, or go with an f1a kit.

__________________


02-12-2012, 02:47 PM #63

slow67

TECH Addict


Trader Rating: 2Join Date: Nov 2004

Location: DFW

Posts: 2,249

Quote:


You stomp it in 4th and it downshifts to 3rd and boost comes up and the car goes.

FYI, I would recommend putting the shifter in 3rd when your makin power. It brings on the over-run clutches to help out the overdrive roller clutch.

__________________Black 2000 SS Camaro Jake's Performance 4L80E w/ Jake's Transbrake.

02-12-2012, 03:32 PM #64

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

Quote:

Originally Posted by slow67


So are you saying drop it into 3rd, then shift into 4th? Or just run it in 3rd to redline- like you are running a TH400 w/ a 1:1 ratio.

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-12-2012, 03:42 PM #65

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

Quote:



Thanks for the advice. I have romped on it a few times with bringing the shifter down to 3rd and done it with the the shifter in 4th. I will quit stomping it in 4th now. It was only to about 5100 rpms and 10psi so it probably didnt hurt too much, hopefully.



02-12-2012, 03:44 PM #66

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

Quote:


Noooo! That Procharger is a huge reason why I'm such a fan of your car!

I like the procharger, but I think I am going to get annoyed with the whine at idle. Thanks for the flattering comments. . . I am worried about slipping the belt later on when it starts making more boost. I will give it a year or so and see what happens.



02-13-2012, 09:27 AM #67

slow67

TECH Addict


Trader Rating: 2Join Date: Nov 2004

Location: DFW

Posts: 2,249

Quote:


So are you saying drop it into 3rd, then shift into 4th? Or just run it in 3rd to redline- like you are running a TH400 w/ a 1:1 ratio.

Like a th400 to redline (unless you need more speed than 3rd will give you, and know the risks).

Quote:


Thanks for the advice. I have romped on it a few times with bringing the shifter down to 3rd and done it with the the shifter in 4th. I will quit stomping it in 4th now. It was only to about 5100 rpms and 10psi so it probably didnt hurt too much, hopefully.

If the car still drives normally in the D4 position, then you probably haven't hurt anything.

__________________Black 2000 SS Camaro Jake's Performance 4L80E w/ Jake's Transbrake.

02-13-2012, 11:50 AM #68

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Alright, ordered a MadMan 4l80e dipstick this morning. Did some researching and it seems that's the best option. It's just like the stocker and locks, without any of the filling problems that some people have with the lokar. It's cheaper too!

I also have a cooler lined up somewhat local (jacksonville) that I'll be buying from a member here shortly. It'll be a B&M stacked plate, and I'll be using his fittings from his old TH400 setup, and running my own hose.

That should pretty much do it with big purchases. Only thing really left is miscellaneous items like wiring, sheet metal for covering the hole, fluid, etc. Now I just need to find the time to get this thing rocking.

__________________


02-13-2012, 11:52 AM #69

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

Quote:


Alright, ordered a MadMan 4l80e dipstick this morning. Did some researching and it seems that's the best option. It's just like the stocker and locks, without any of the filling problems that some people have with the lokar. It's cheaper too!

I'll have to see how yours works out

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-13-2012, 04:44 PM #70

Cam72aro

TECH Fanatic




Posts: 1,364

Quote:


If the car still drives normally in the D4 position, then you probably haven't hurt anything.

Its does. I drove it a while in od after I made a fews pulls in it. Thanks for the help.



Last edited by Cam72aro; 02-13-2012 at 05:36 PM..

02-13-2012, 08:52 PM #71

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

So the Drum, gaskets and seals, and slip yoke came in the mail today. Since I had a little time I stopped by the shop to put back together the clutch assembly part of the direct drum. And since I was in a rush I forgot my camera, so I had to make due with my Iphone camera.

First off I removed the second seal on the center support as per instructions for the transbrake to complete the dual feed setup.

Here's the nice, used drum. Complete with drain hold already drilled thanks to Elite!

First up I reinstalled the piston. This was a little bit of a PITA to get seated right without the alignment tool, but I got it. I put a light coating of lube on it and fought it for about 15 minutes before I gave up and lubed it up pretty good. After that, it went on real easily, lol. So lesson learned, the more lube the easier it is!

Then it's time for the handy clamps to compress the spring and install the snap ring.

Then I installed the clutch pack. First I installed the bottom plate, which is slanted downwards towards the center of the drum. Then I put in the steel plates and clutches, starting with a steel plate. Then the top retaining steel plate and snap ring. When that was done, I added some fresh tranny fluid to soak in there.

So pretty much all I'm waiting on is the 34 element sprag and then I can bolt this thing back together!

__________________


02-13-2012, 09:21 PM #72

armyinfantry3id

Teching In


Trader Rating: 0Join Date: Aug 2011

Location: ocala, fl

Posts: 19

looking good man, hope the build goes good. im gonna need to get the HP tuners from you in about a week, my LS1 swap is almost done...and i got that window ready for you!

__________________95 Z28, LS1 Swap, custom paint, ebay special longtubes, magnaflow catback, K&N cold air intake, Torq Thrust M special edition rims, BMR K Member, BMR Lower A-arms, hotchkis lowering springs

02-13-2012, 09:24 PM #73

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by armyinfantry3id

looking good man, hope the build goes good. im gonna need to get the HP tuners from you in about a week, my LS1 swap is almost done...and i got that window ready for you!

I was just thinking about that window an hour ago or so, lol. I was supposed to come get it last Thursday. I ended up hurting my shoulder at the gym and went to the Dr. Thursday and forgot all about it, I'll give ya a text tomorrow.

__________________


02-14-2012, 12:17 AM #74

armyinfantry3id

Teching In


Trader Rating: 0Join Date: Aug 2011

Location: ocala, fl

Posts: 19

hey its cool...im getting tires put on the "beater car" in the morning so weds. would be better, btw this window is on me!

__________________95 Z28, LS1 Swap, custom paint, ebay special longtubes, magnaflow catback, K&N cold air intake, Torq Thrust M special edition rims, BMR K Member, BMR Lower A-arms, hotchkis lowering springs

02-16-2012, 10:21 PM #75

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Haven't gotten a whole lot done the past couple of days. Still waiting on my 34 element sprag to come it. But, I did get some parts in the mail.

connector for the shifter

Madman 4l80e dipstick

Slip yoke

And, a couple tranny coolers

I ended up picking up both of these coolers and the fittings for $65 shipped. I figure to run them in a series and I won't have any cooling problems. Just need to pick up some 3/8 hose and I'll be good to go.

Then came the decision of what to do about the case and how to paint it. Well I won a little money after the Superbowl, so I figured I'll use that towards getting it powder coated. I dropped it off at the coaters today and will be getting it done in a semi gloss black. But before I did I went ahead and cut off the ears and anything else I figured might get in the way.

Won't get the case back until mid next week, and hopefully the sprag will be in too. Then I'll be able to reassemble the tranny and start putting her in!

__________________


02-16-2012, 10:33 PM #76

LongIsland63SS409

Launching!




Posts: 200

Thanks for the updates and progress.

Details on the slip yoke? Dim from the end to the center of the u joint?

Thanks,Mike


02-16-2012, 10:38 PM #77

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by LongIsland63SS409

Thanks for the updates and progress.

Details on the slip yoke? Dim from the end to the center of the u joint?

Thanks,Mike

7.9". Just a standard th400/1350 yoke. Since my transmission is splined all the way, I may be alright. I may have to cut it down, doubt it though.

__________________


02-16-2012, 11:51 PM #78

Jake's Performance

LS1Tech Sponsor



Posts: 770

Quote:


First up I reinstalled the piston. This was a little bit of a PITA to get seated right without the alignment tool, but I got it. I put a light coating of lube on it and fought it for about 15 minutes before I gave up and lubed it up pretty good. After that, it went on real easily, lol. So lesson learned, the more lube the easier it is!

I hope you used some type of lip seal installer tool to install the piston.You can't just push the piston in, no matter how much lube. The seals must be worked into place so they don't get cut or rolled.

Be sure to air check it. Sit it on the center support, block one of the feed holes, and blow air in the opposite. Be sure the clutches apply and no air leaks are present.

__________________GM Racing Automatics from the company that designs the parts, not just another parts assembler.www.jakesperformance.comRacing Automatic Transmission Tech www.race-trans-tech.com

02-16-2012, 11:57 PM #79

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

I just used a general lip seal tool that I got with the seals/gaskets I ordered. The manual shows a different tool and I figured that was some sort of alignment tool to line up the piston. I'll be sure to check it when I get the case back.

__________________


02-17-2012, 06:18 AM #80

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

Looks like some good progress!

-In regards to the trans coolers- I recommend the bar/plate one (black) over the tube/fin. There was a few threads about how the bar/plate cooler is superior. Also, add a small fan to it and you'll never have trans temp issues. -The madman dipstick looks great! Mine should arrive Monday. Are you going to powder coat that as well?-What part number is your slip yoke? I was looking at the Strange U1650 one.-I might have missed this, but what shifter are you using? I was going to use a stock A4 shifter.

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

Page 4 of 9

First

Last


02-17-2012, 08:54 AM #81

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:


Looks like some good progress!

-In regards to the trans coolers- I recommend the bar/plate one (black) over the tube/fin. There was a few threads about how the bar/plate cooler is superior. Also, add a small fan to it and you'll never have trans temp issues. -The madman dipstick looks great! Mine should arrive Monday. Are you going to powder coat that as well?-What part number is your slip yoke? I was looking at the Strange U1650 one.-I might have missed this, but what shifter are you using? I was going to use a stock A4 shifter.

I'm going to try just running both inline, with the fluid going to the tube/fin first and then the stack plate, and then going back to the transmission.

not gonna powder coat the dipstick, it's nice and clean as it

The part number on my order was 3-3-5551X NCB. It's not a strange or anything, just a NOS replacement.

I'm using the stock shifter. As part of the sale of my t56, I got the guys pedals, shifter and cable, and center console.

__________________


02-20-2012, 10:15 AM #82

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Haven't forgot about this thread!! Spent some time with a motorcylce I've been working on this weekend. '87 Honda Shadow VT1100. Sat for 6 years, so been doing the normal maintenance stuff, and took the carb off and began a rebuild. That'll make my first engine build over the summer, first tranny work with this build, and first carb rebuild with the motorcycle too. That's a lot of first for one year, lol.

Anyways, sprag was not in stock and should be shipped out today from Tampa (hour and a half away). And supposed to get the case back from powdercoating on Wednesday. In the mean time I can get some wiring done, mostly stuff that's in the how to's here on tech on getting the shifter to work in an M6 car. Also gonna install the wideband and pillar pod/gauge as well.

__________________


02-20-2012, 12:09 PM #83

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

....and the snowball effect is in full swing. There's a "0411" pcm for sale local to me for REALLY cheap. Now I'm pondering swapping to a '99-up computer since I'm doing all this work anyways and retuning. Only thing is I've already wasted 2 credits downloading the stock file on my '98 (shoulda just been patient and waited until I really needed to tune it). So I'd waste another 2 credits getting into the new pcm, and another 2 for a segment swap to make the gas tank work. But, I still need to use 2 credits for a full write with an auto OS as is for the '98 pcm. So, it comes down to a bunch of time and wasting 6 total credits for a newer pcm (which is auto already), or keep what I got with a '98 pcm and just use 4 credits.

__________________


02-20-2012, 01:11 PM #84

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Alright, I was wrong on the cost. Just sent an email to hptuners. They don't charge for a segment swap. So either way I'm looking at 4 credits. Seems like a no brainer to me right?

__________________


02-20-2012, 01:24 PM #85

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

I looked into this a while ago. I think there is more to it than just swapping a PCM and re-pinning. I think it involved all new stuff- gauge cluster, interior harness, engine/trans harness. That's if you wanted everything to work like stock.

The main issues between the 98 vs. 99-02 cars is the coolant temp sender and the fuel sender.

I'd do more research before picking a route.

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-20-2012, 01:27 PM #86

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Those issues are if you are trying to use a '99-up pcm AND harness. If you just repin the '98 harness to work with the '99-up pcm, you'll only lose the fuel gauge, which can be fixed with a segment swap. Before the segment swaps, people would just swap the whole gastank/sender.

__________________


02-20-2012, 01:30 PM #87

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

Oh ok. Cool.

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-20-2012, 01:33 PM #88

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Ya, just spent the last hour and a half researching the swap. Some sensors are different on the '98 cars since the cluster reads off sensor and not serial cable from pcm. So while it doesn't make a difference when repinning for a new computer, using a newer harness will complicate things. Plus, I gotta pin in some new locations for the trans harness anyways, why not add a couple hours of torture by removing, labeling, and replacing pins, lol.

__________________


02-20-2012, 01:38 PM #89

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

What is the purpose of running the 99-02 segment then? Did I miss this?

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-20-2012, 01:41 PM #90

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Faster processor, custom OS ability, more tables, more resolution in VE, etc. Not really a big deal, as the '98 computer can handle what I got....but for the long run why not? It's gonna cost me the same anyways since I need another 2 credits to write an auto OS.

__________________


02-20-2012, 01:45 PM #91

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

Oh ok. Well take some good notes and pictures. I might end up doing the same!!!!

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-21-2012, 05:49 PM #92

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Got a few things done today, and got my MWC 4l80e crossmember in too.

Here's the crossmember

And I started the long process of wiring.

Wanted to make sure my measurement of wire was correct, so I started looming the harness that I made and taped it to the longest possible route the harness would have to take.

It was the perfect length using that route. I also started doing the wiring for the shifter as well. I started looking for the proper wiring at the kickpanel for the PNP signal, as well as reverse lights. I didn't see them, so I went to the trusty diagrams. I'm my '98, the PNP signal is pin 32 on the red connector. Sure enough, It wasn't there. I figured as much since I'm still using the M6 harness. So I brought out the wiring and put a pin on a wire, ran it through the firewall, and to the shifter. Now I just gotta deal with the neutral safety wiring. I also started looking at my diagram for the 4l80e harness and noticed I need a signal to the PCM from the brakes for the release of the tcc. Sure enough, there was no pin there. So I'm gonna have to go back and see what I can do about that as well. Sure glad I bought about 5 extra pins, lol. Either way, I'll just probably tap into the brake switch wiring and run that through the firewall as well.

__________________


02-21-2012, 07:16 PM #93

White.Lightning

TECH Addict




Posts: 2,532

Good progress on the wiring. You should make a little schematic showing what pins were moved, what wires were added, etc.

__________________

1998 T/A Mods/Pics

02-21-2012, 08:42 PM #94

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

The wiring to get the shifter to work is easily available searching and in the two main "a4-m6/m6-a4" swap threads that everyone refers to. I just forgot that I'm still using my m6 harness....so I don't have those wires. As far was the wiring to get the 4l80e running, I'm not at liberty to give that info out. It's very inexpensive to get that info from Slow67 and is more than worth it when compared to everything else in the swap.

__________________


02-22-2012, 05:52 PM #95

john59

On The Tree



Location: Stuart, Florida

Posts: 178

Hi Guys I swapped an LS2 4L80 into my 89 S10 Blazer, these came in handy.6an or 8an

http://www.towersracingparts.com/servlet/Categories

Great write up by the way

__________________01 Corvette Vert. Vararam CAI/4.10 Rear/Hardened Shafts//Ported 90mm Throttle body/Fast Intake/224/228 581-588-112/TSP 2.5-5.3 milled to 59cc/.040 Cometics/PRC Dual Springs/Hardened pushrods/B&B Catback/Kooks Headers 1 3/4 with 3" off road Xpipe/Z06 sway bars/ Double Drilled Discs/Bilstein Shocks /Lowered

1989 S10 Blazer 2Dr. LS2/4L80 and 8.8 Ford Rear in the works and almost done

02-22-2012, 09:08 PM #96

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Stopped out to the shop today and again discovered that I don't have the connector for the tcc release/brake switch cause of my m6 harness. Well, 3 years of law school paid off and I began researching. Finally I discovered the part number. It's ACDelco PT483 just in case anyone needs to know, lol.

I found it on rock auto for about $18......or I will just hit a junk yard tomorrow. Then all I need to do is run another wire/pin to the pcm and the other side to an ign 12v source. Found the reverse and neutral safety wires, so just gotta wire those in.

__________________


02-22-2012, 09:12 PM #97

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by john59

Hi Guys I swapped an LS2 4L80 into my 89 S10 Blazer, these came in handy.6an or 8an

http://www.towersracingparts.com/servlet/Categories

Great write up by the way

Thanks. I'm just sticking with the old NPT fittins, rubber hose, and tranny cooler setup.

__________________


02-23-2012, 01:52 PM #98

RedRocketZ28

12 Second Club



Location: Des Moines, IA

Posts: 994

Thanks for keeping the thread updated with detailed pics. I just scored a 94 4L80E with less than 80k miles on it for $200. I will be tackling this in the next couple of months.

__________________2001 Z28 M6 1SC - Turbo LQ4 in the works...2000 SS M6 #5445 - Sold 11/4/10

02-24-2012, 12:25 AM #99

black00ssFL

TECH Resident



Location: Ocala, FL

Posts: 994

Ok....busy busy busy wiring day. Went to the local junk yard and picked up the plug for the brake switch, even let me have it for free! (minus the $1 they charge to get in). So I got ALL of the wiring issues done and dealt with. The two main things you'll be dealing with if still using an M6 harness is the PNP wire from the pcm and the brake switch into the pcm. Here's how to do it (sorry no pics):

PNP wire: This one is fairly "simple". Unplug the connectors from the pcm and locate which pin is the pnp wire. Get a 20g primary wire, put a pin on it, run it through the firewall grommet under the PCM, and connect it to the corresponding switch on the shifter.

Brake switch: a little more tricky. Get the 4 prong plug using the p/n I listed above, or from a junk yard. Now one wire needs a 12v ignition source, and the other goes to the pcm. Again, I made one 20g wire with a pin, pinned it in the proper location on the harness, then ran the wire through the grommet and to the switch. Now for the ignition source. Conveniently, there's an ign power source in the interior fuse panel. Search in the stereo section to find out where. I used just a male flat blade with a fused wire and ran it to the other wire on the switch. Then I tested it out with the trusty circuit tester. It should have 12v normally, and no power when the brakes are pushed.

During that an getting other wiring done (also wired in my a/f gauge and LC1 kit), I got to go pick up the case from the powder coater.

Then I went back to finish the above wiring project. Then it was working on getting the Trans harness in. I pinned all the connections that needed it and installed the harness. As stated above I can't give out too much info on this. And I onl

Documents

4l80e Teardown Rebuild and Installation