COPING WITH & UNDERSTANDING LAND & …...NICE GUYS FINISH LAST ?? Ask Larry… His great grandfather bought the land in 1865 His family has been on it since. In 1975 they discovered

For Exclusive Use of Attendees of NJSPLS SurvCon 2013 1

COPING WITH & UNDERSTANDINGLAND & BOUNDARY DISPUTES

A TRIP THROUGH THE LEGAL AND “OTHER” WORLD OF THE

SURVEYOR

NJSPLS SURVCON 2013

A Presentation by:Walt Robillard, Esq., RLS

Attorney at LawRegistered Surveyor

Foresterand just a …“nice guy”

Contact Information:1601 Berkeley Lane NEAtlanta, GA 30239

[email protected]


A Few Career Highlights:

1983 BA Geography/CartographyState University of NY at BuffaloRelocated to Florida

1990 Licensed in Florida, PSM # 4838

1991 Started Business During Economic “Downturn”Buchheit Associates, Inc. Surveyors & MappersFlorida Licensed Business LB # 6167100% Woman Owned Business

2005 Tuck School of Business (MBEP)

2008 Florida Licensed Continuing Education ProviderCE # 67, Provider Number 0004570

2012 The ACSM Radio Hour with Curt Sumner On America’s Web RadioGuest, February 20, 2012

2012 Surveyor In Residence (March)Abraham Lincoln’s National Museum of Surveyingpictured left

Assisted by:Kimberly A. Buchheit, PSMProfessional Surveyor & Mapper

Contact Information:Kimberly A. Buchheit, PSM

Buchheit Associates, Inc. Surveyors & Mappers427 Centerpointe Cir., Suite 1811

Altamonte Springs, FL [email protected]

UNDERSTANDING THE TYPE OF DISPUTE

FIRST QUESTION (2 REALLY)

A‐IS IT A QUESTION OF TITLE?

OR

B‐IS IT A QUESTION OF BOUNDARY?

SECOND QUESTION

SHOULD I ASSOCIATE WITH AN ATTORNEY?


In 1912 A.C. Mulford wrote

BEFORE leaving this general subject it would perhaps be well to consider for a few moments the relation between the surveyor and the one who may perhaps be called his

co‐worker– the LAWYER.

WHO SHOULD KNOW WHAT

The Surveyor Should

1. Understand retracements

2. Know local & federal law of retracements

3. Understand the history of the problem


WHO SHOULD KNOW WHAT

The Lawyer Should

1. Be conversant of surveying

2. Know his local law of retracements

3. Engage the surveyor early in the dispute

IN A “RETRACEMENT”

THE HARDEST JOB IS TO

FIND THE

LAND

TO BE

SURVEYED


One of the very first U.S. Supreme Court decisions that had to deal with U.S.G.L.O.


• The power to make and correct surveys of the public lands belongs to the political department of the government, and while the lands are subject to the supervision of the General Land Office, its decisions in such cases are unassailable by the courts, except by a direct proceeding.

• It is not within the province of a Circuit Court of the United States or of this court to consider and determine whether an official survey duly made, with a plat thereof filed in the District Land Office, is erroneous; but, with an exception referred to in the opinion, the correction of errors in such surveys has devolved from the earliest days upon the Commissioner of the General Land Office, under the supervision of his official superior, and his decisions are unassailable by the courts, except in a direct proceeding instituted for that purpose.


• When the General Land Office had once made and approved a governmental survey of public lands, the plats, maps, field notes and certificates having been filed in the proper office, and has sold or disposed of such lands, the courts have power to protect the private rights of a party who has purchased in good faith from the government, against the interferences or appropriations of subsequent corrective resurveys made by the Land Office.

“CLEAN HANDS DOCTRINE”

• One who acquires land knowing that it covers a portion of a tract claimed by another will be held either not to mean to acquire the tract of the other, or will be considered to be watching for the accidental mistake of others, and preparing to take advantage of them, and as such not entitled to receive aid from a court of equity.


NO PERSON IS IMMUNE FROM UNDERSTANDING THESE REQUIREMENTS.

NOT TO UNDERSTAND THEM COULD BE FATAL TO BOTH THE ATTORNEY AND THE SURVEYOR.

GOVERNMENT AGENCIES DO NOT GET A PASS. THEY MUST FOLLOW THE LAW, AS WELL AS PRIVATE INDIVIDUALS.


MANY SURVEYORS ACT AS (& WANT TO BE)

DOCTORSBRAIN SURGEONSPROCTOLOGISTSDENTISTSENGINEERSLAWYERSSO LET’S LOOK AT THIS MISSISSIPPI DECISION. WHAT WOULD YOU DO ?


THE QUESTIONS

1. WAS A TOWNSHIP LINE CREATED BY THE GLO?

2. WHERE IS THE TOWNSHIP LINE?

3. DID THE FOREST SERVICE HAVE THE AUTHORITY OF ADD THE BROKEN LINE?

4. WHAT IS THE SURVEYOR’S RESPONSIBILITY

WHAT ABOUT THIS DESCRIPTION?

LOOK AT IT CLOSELY!!!

THIS IS A PARCEL OF LAND THE U.S. BOUGHT.

WHAT WOULD YOU DO?


QUESTIONS

1ST LINE. WHAT CONTROLS. IS THERE A CORNER

OR A POINT?

7TH LINE. WHAT CONTROLS?

18TH LINE. IS THERE A CORNER?

LAST LINE. IS THE AREA CONTROLLING?


WHAT WOULD YOU DO?

DETAIL

LOOKING TOWARDS THE RR.


LOOKING EAST



New York v. Oneida Tribe

Notes:

1.Oneidas gave up land by treaty in 1799.

2. State described 3 million acres w/o survey.

3. Independent survey made and descriptions made. WITHOUT REFERENCE TO STATUTE.

4. State sold lands to citizens.

5. 2006 Oneidas say treaty is void & want lands back.

1799 TREATY WITH NEW YORK


TITLE & BOUNDARIES

1. Is the Oneida title good?

2. What boundaries control?

A. Legislative

B. Surveyed

THE “WAR PATH”

BUT THROUGH THE COURTS



2ND TRACT


PRIORITY ELEMENTS

1. Artificial features

2. Natural features

3. Adjoiners

? What is the basis of bearing

? How precise are the measurements


1. 1 Degree change

97’ (1.5 chs)in 80 chain

2. Bearings +/‐ ½ deg.

3.Distances to 0 chs.



The problem

Was $0.01

What is the

precision of the

Original field

measurements?


THE FINAL PRODUCT


An original line is "the one that was surveyed in marking of the lot by numbers, in the first or original survey." Davis v. Guffey, 196 Ga. 816, 27 S.E.2d 689 (1943). The boundary lines at issue in this case were established by the original survey of 1832. The parties hold title to their respective tracts of land and the issue is the location of the dividing lines separating the property of the parties on the south and east sides of the property of the plaintiff, Dr. Howell. Each party contends the line claimed by him or it to be the correct dividing line and that the line advocated by each party under the evidence in the case is the original line as placed by the 1832 survey.


Ga.Code provides in all cases of disputed lines the following rules shall be respected and followed: Natural landmarks, being less liable to change, and not capable of counterfeit, shall be the most conclusive evidence: Ancient or genuine landmarks, such as corner station or marked trees, shall control the course and distance called for by the survey. If the corners are established, and the lines not marked, a straight line, as required by the plat, shall be run, but an established marked line, though crooked, shall not be overruled; courses and distances shall be resorted to in the absence of higher evidence.

In Riley v. Griffin, 16 Ga. 141 (1854), a case relied upon by both parties, it was held: And thus, it will be seen that courses and distances occupy the lowest grade, instead of the highest, in the scale of evidence, as to the identity of land.

Barba Inv. Co. v. Walker350 fed 509 (Fla. 1977)


Appellant property owners sought review of a decision from the trial court (Florida), which entered judgment in favor of appellee property owners in a boundary dispute, determining that appellees' fence did not encroach upon the property of appellants.

The court reversed the decision that entered a judgment in favor of appellee property owners in a boundary dispute, finding that the disputed common corner of the adjoining properties was a lost corner, which appellees did not establish by showing they attempted a dependent survey in an effort to relocate the location of the lost monument.


The lower court might have been troubled by the testimony of appellees' surveyor who stated that the boundaries of property owners not involved in the dispute would be shifted if the Baskerville monument was accepted as the true corner. nevertheless, persons with lands not abutting on a disputed boundary may not be joined as parties to the boundary dispute. Stark v. Marshall, 67 So.2d 235 (Fla.1953); Gibson

NICE GUYS FINISH LAST ??

Ask Larry…

His great grandfather bought the land in 1865

His family has been on it since.

In 1975 they discovered oil.

Oil company did the “survey” using USGS quads.

Larry thought they were in error.

Confronted the oil co.

Well was Drilled and they hit it…


…Oil That is

“Black Gold”

HIS CO$TLY ENDEAVORS

1. Contacted a local young attorney who had just been admitted to the bar.

2. BUT HE WAS INEXPENSIVE.

3. Sued Miss. Oil board for boundary determination.

4. LOST

5. Sought professional help.

6. Ended up contacting 5 more attorneys.

7. They only took his $$$$$.


This is the map the oil company used

WHO SAID IT ??

There is a Reasonable Answer

to a Complex Problem

and

It is usually Simple, Neat and

Probably WRONG.


IN CLOSING

A.C. MULFORD (1912):

For after all, when it comes to a question of stability of property and the peace of the community (and the world) it is far more important to have a somewhat faulty measurement of the spot where the line truly exists than it is to have an extremely accurate measurement of the place where the line does not exist at all.

Nice Guys Finish Last…

THANK YOU !

Documents

COPING WITH & UNDERSTANDING LAND & …...NICE GUYS FINISH LAST ?? Ask Larry… His great grandfather bought the land in 1865 His family has been on it since. In 1975 they discovered