A conversation A conversation with artist Azad with artist Azad Karim Mohammed Karim Mohammed about Saabat about Saabat Community Gallery Community Gallery on Normanby Road, on Normanby Road, South Bank.South Bank.

Black Path Press May 2019

* The following is an edited transcription of an interview with Azad Karim Mohammed by Foundation Press, which happened in South Bank on Tuesday 14 May 2019. ** FP = Foundation Press / AKM = Azad Karim Mohammed.*** Image: A greetings card celebrating the 50th Jubilee of South Bank Primitive Methodist Church in 1928. This image was provided courtesy of John Chilvers and South Bank Local History Group.

AKM: Originally the building was the Primitive Methodist Chapel for South Bank, built in 1878. After that it has turned into various things; it was the wedding salon – thousands of people got married here, then it was owned by the council and was used as a training centre for apprenticeships also. It has been sat closed and empty for many years as well.

When I first saw the building it was being used as South Bank youth centre. I have had this building since November 2013, from that day up to now we have worked to transform the building into a community art gallery with the name Saabat.

FP: We are sat upstairs in a beautiful sunny, communally-used room in Saabat Gallery, it has tall windows and round the edges are a number of large, unfinished, colourful paintings by Mel Connell. To begin with, would you please talk to us about the building we are in? What are its origins?

* Left: Artists selling their work at Saabat Gallery Art Fair. ** Right: Sculpture workshop being led by Azad Karim Mohammed.

FP: How did you first come to work with this building in South Bank?

AKM: I moved to South Bank in 2007 and I had an art studio called Babilon in number 112 over the Normanby Road. It was a really difficult time for me, both running my business and growing my reputation as an artist. My business is working in mould-making, creating statues, garden furniture, sculptures and architectural features – it was quite a struggle, but I really like this area. This area has a really rich history, although since the Second World War it has declined, ICI, the steel works and shipyard and various other things have closed down – people have been moving

out of the area. This makes it a challenging place to be, but also an interesting place to be.

People would always say, ‘What are you doing in South Bank? Why an art gallery in South Bank?’ Many people think it’s strange, the idea of opening a gallery here – friends, even some people in the council and the police officers!

I hope it has an effect on the area, maybe more businesses will open on this street. Last week a new laundry bar opened up the road and they might have seen Saabat and thought, ‘an art gallery – something is going on here!’ So hopefully more businesses open up here.

We are really interested in the challenge of running a community art gallery here, we believe that South Bank needs it.

* Left: Azad Karim Mohammed being awarded The Major’s Community Achievement Award by Karen King in 2018. Also in the image are Councillor Ian Jeffrey and Saabat volunteer Janet Jeffrey.

FP: And you mentioned about your background making sculptures and statues, would you tell us a little more about where these skills came from?

AKM: My full Name is Azad Karim Mohammed, I was born in 1966 and I grew up in Northern Iraq, in Erbil, which is now capital of an independent area. In 1989 I finished my degree in the Academy of Fine Arts in Baghdad University with a full honours in Classical Sculpture. After 1992, I left Iraq after the war there. I moved to Turkey – where I established a business, putting my skills from studying sculpture to use by manufacturing fibreglass moulds for interior design and architectural design. I worked on large-scale jobs, often restoration projects in Greece and Italy.

It was 2001 when I moved to England, I originally went to Buckinghamshire but moved up to Middlesbrough pretty soon after that (in 2002). I liked Middlesbrough a lot – even though it is quite a poor area it is also very rich, its beautiful countryside, landscapes, the seaside…

FP: Do you remember how you made the decision to come to Middlesbrough?

AKM: Yeah, to be honest it was when my daughter was born in Aylesbury hospital. We were talking to a health visitor to the hospital, who asked us, ‘where do you want to live?’ I told her that we had a shortlist with two cities on it, one in the north and one in the south, either Southampton or Middlesbrough! I remember her helping making up our mind by saying, ‘Teesside is a lovely the place, the people are friendly and honest’. And when we visited the area for the first time I was convinced. I am a person who can’t live without nature. The seaside at Redcar is just 7 miles away, the North Yorkshire Moors National Park, the Cleveland Way, Roseberry Topping. My wife was more drawn to the south and obviously all the business are down there. But I think we were very tired, a lot of moving, a lot of war and conflict, running and rebuilding, restarting our lives from scratch three times, in three different cultures, learning three different languages. It was challenging for us, the language barrier and the job opportunities. My wife holds two degrees but she cannot find a job since we live in this town, one degree in IT and another one in Art Literature – she is teaching now, privately. But it’s a real challenge.

FP: What has been done to the building?

AKM: I heard that this building was due to be demolished. I have spent my entire life working with restoration, I like historic buildings – without this architecture we cannot identify or define ourselves. I begun to speak to Redcar & Cleveland Council about the building, which in 2013, was actually three huge buildings. I enquired about buying it, but the council didn’t want to sell it or didn’t think I could raise the required sum of money. My brother Pishtiwan, who is quite wealthy, supported me in the project. My brother is a businessman and he suggested that we should turn the building into really nice flats. But I was determined that it should be an art gallery and studios. My brother lives in Buckingham, he is 10 years younger than me, he was actually my student once upon a time at the College of Art! But he agreed to help me, financially, with the idea of Saabat Gallery. I talked with locals, my MP and the Council about why they were demolishing the building. I proposed they demolish two of the buildings but sell me the end part – the original Methodist Chapel. The Council told me they didn’t want to do this and they would demolish it. It was actually at this point that I got a job in Iraq teaching and I think, ‘Okay that’s it finished, it’s not happening’. But I get a call the next

day saying the Council will sell me the building. Three days later I have contractors on the building working – I was ready to go! I spent so much money and had so much support from my family, especially my lovely wife Ikram, my son Ali and my daughter Naz. Since then we have new roof, a new boundary, the gable wall added in. The upstairs has been transformed – where we are now sitting. Central Heating is installed and working. I am now building further studio places upstairs in the attic. Still it is an expensive project, taking more and more money – but most of the jobs I am able to do myself to save money. As I work elsewhere and am also doing PhD I am only able to develop Saabat on a part-time basis – but we are gradually getting there.

* Above: The gable end and boundary of Saabat Gallery being worked on following the demolition of the attaching buildings in 2013.

FP: Saabat is clearly a real passion of yours – you are putting so much into it.

AKM: I am in love with this building otherwise it is a huge building, it is a passion and also a challenge. I don’t like to fail. Sometimes this feels selfish, but usually most artists can be selfish!

FP: Where did the name for the building come from? What does Saabat mean?

AKM: It is a mixture of things. It references the word sabbatical, the idea of a break, especially a creative one. It also could mean Sabbath. It also contains a bit of the Gaelic word for shade (scáth) – I like the idea that Saabat Gallery is shade for the artists! I was outside and some locals were talking, looking at me, black hair, brown skin and saying ‘they’re going to change this building into a mosque’. I say to them, ‘it’s a different sort of temple – it’s a temple for the artists!’

* Left: Talk by Richard Clayton, as part of his exhibition ‘Over The Border And Beyond’ – which featured photographs of St.Hilda’s area of Middlesbrough from the 1970s onwards.** Next page: Classical statues made by Azad Karim Mohammed adorn the corners of the Saabat Gallery building.

FP: Can you talk us through the different things that happen in Saabat Gallery?

AKM: It’s really important for us to engage both the local community and also artists. A gallery can generate an economy for artists, so we currently have 5 artists studios within the building, different artists making their work here. We have events with schools and community groups. We are also interested in the future of thinking about how Saabat can be a sort of bridge between different cultures. I come from a different background, a different country – I have exhibited work all over the world and I would love to bring people into South Bank or take work by artists in South Bank, Teesside to other countries. It is a challenge to be an artist living here so we try to have an exhibition most months of the year, some of these exhibitions are with local schools or community groups.

Up to now we haven’t had any financial support from Arts Council, local council or anyone other than myself. I use my own skills – I think I have too many different skills! This might be my weakness, my wife Ikram says, ‘try to stick with just one skill! You can’t catch two rabbits at one time!’ But the Saabat team is expanding, which is important – so it’s not

just me. Saabat is now supported by Mel Connell and Maureen McAdams. We also have some great volunteers who help with the Community Garden, led by Ted Johnson, and also Janet Jeffrey and Raymond Husband who support the management of the gallery as well. Mel and Maureen, in particular, are leading the way with planning the future of Saabat and coming up with ideas for how we use the building in the future.

FP: Tell us a bit more about the Saabat Community Garden?

AKM: Local resident Ted Johnson and South Bank in Bloom asked about using the building for a garden. We use the gallery to bring in the artists but the garden can connect to others and create a crossover point for schools and people living locally to get involved in it. At some stage, I am interested in making a sculpture garden – the first Sculpture Garden on Teesside! We also imagine that you might be able to hold outdoor film screenings in the summer, on the back wall of the building – like Cinema Paradiso, you remember that film? Bring more life to the area and get people together.

* This page: Saabat Community Garden in Spring.** Previous Page: Ivan Wood painting in his studio in Saabat Gallery.

FP: How can people get involved in what you do here? Are there specific opening times?

AKM: During exhibitions we are currently open Wednesday and Thursdays 3-6pm, Friday 11am-6pm and Saturday 10am-12pm. In future we hope to be open even more. The space is a hireable also, so it can be used by anyone who wants to put on a show, talk, workshop or project – we welcome ideas. You can also get involved in volunteering and helping out in the community garden. Generally we have tried to pick exhibitions which are interesting to people living here. For example Jonathan Turner and Richard Clayton – two really sensitive photography exhibitions. People came from all over to see Richard’s photographs. South Bank’s community used to be one of the biggest on Teesside but is now very small – so we try to make it relevant and welcoming to all. This month we have Graham Canwell’s exhibition of painting, also we have the exhibition of ‘Beyond Graduation’ bringing together 29 artists that have graduated from Teesside University since 2007 up to 2018. Depending upon funding, we hope to put on an exhibition and celebration for the artist David Mulholland who painted and drew this area so well – including the Black Path. We also have your Black Path Press event here in July – sharing work made by different local

groups. Last year we had a community barbecue, especially for local people. 50-60 people came to the last one, all from very different backgrounds including Syrian and Yemeni refugees who have just moved to the area.

FP: Thinking about the history of things that have happened here, what are your favourite exhibitions or events that have been in Saabat Gallery?

AKM: We have had some great exhibitions but also artist talks. I was a part of an exhibition called ‘Heterotopia’, which had four artists in. We had a real mix of artists and academics come together for this exhibition. Saud Baloch who comes from Balochistan in Pakistan and makes work about colonialism, Ray Husband’s work about the austerity in England and my friend Ausama Al Khalil – who I studied alongside in Baghdad. Sadly, Ausama committed suicide in 2016 – he was living in Middlesbrough and couldn’t

FP: What are your ambitions and vision for the future of Saabat Gallery?

AKM: We are converting the attic into two live-in artist studios. So this could be for artist residencies, bringing artists into South Bank and giving them somewhere affordable to stay. Or even just people who want to escape to draw the landscape – it could be like an artist hotel! We want to build our workshop programme, we have held several sculpture workshops but also want to support people to make work in ceramics, printmaking and Mel is also looking into creating a darkroom so we can also support film photography. We are hoping in the future that we can convert some space on the ground floor into a disabled access art studio, inclusivity is a major part of our plans – we don’t want anyone to be excluded from using the space. We also want to create a shared studio space which can be used by emerging artists or graduates, helping them to get started.

* Right: The launch of a restored clock, moved from the demolished Grangetown Town Hall to the front of Saabat Gallery in 2016.** Previous Page: Saabat Gallery community barbecue event.

objects or crafts that don’t have any function. Artists have a function, they have to culturally impact upon society and have to work with society. Culturally our view of artists need to change; it is not about me making clay pieces with a school or anything like that. It is deeper than that, it is a question of how can an artist impact upon a community, we believe that art can change society, it can provoke and raise different issues. This is why this space has many functions; studio, gallery, workshop, garden and why it is in South Bank.

cope. I guess when we exhibit his work it raises the issue of male suicide, which is going up each year in Teesside. It is a very big problem. And my sculpture work is about migration, exile and the other places. I hope it was an exhibition which raised a lot of big questions.

The installing and launch of the clock on the front of the building was also a really nice moment. The clock is very special, it comes from the old town hall on Fabian Road in Grangetown, Middlesbrough – when the town hall was demolished the community kept the clock. The councillor of the area Ian Jeffrey asked me if Saabat would like to be the new home for this particular clock. We fundraised in order to restore it and also convert it from analogue to digital. We then invited the community and also the families of the original donors who paid for the clock a long, long time ago. It was a lovely, emotional thing. Lots of people came along to a talk about the clock and to see it on the front of this building.

I am an artist, I think as an artist – not necessarily as a director. Anyone can be a director or funder of a gallery, but not anyone can be an artist and the programme we have here comes from this. It is my believe that not any more can an artist just produce

* Above: Visitors to exhibition ‘Seeing South Bank’ by Jonathan Turner in 2018.

Black Path Press is a community publishing project, producing books with people in South Bank, Middlesbrough; an area surrounding the historical route known as the ‘Black Path’. The publications made will explore subjects big and small, past, present and future.

Together, these books will form a collective document of the area – given out to local libraries, museums and individuals. They will also serve as a research and design tool for a public artwork, led by artists Foundation Press, on the site of the Black Path in Autumn 2019.

There will be a pop-up exhibition of material made as part of the Black Path Press project at Saabat Gallery on Friday 12th July 2019. We are immensely grateful to Azad Karim Mohammed, Mel Connell, Maureen McAdams and all the volunteers who help out at Saabat, for making this book and exhibition possible. If you would like to volunteer or know more about events at Saabat Gallery you can follow them on Facebook or pop by during their exhibition opening hours (Weds/Thurs 3-6pm, Fri 11am-6pm and Saturday 10am-2pm).

Saabat Gallery, 83 Normanby road, South Bank, Redcar & Cleveland, TS6 6SA