Episode 200: Most Important Thing for Health With Heather ... › wm.podcast... · founder, Tero, for him foraging and growing local foods is a passion that goes back generations

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Episode200:MostImportantThingforHealth

WithHeatherandKatie


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Child:WelcometomyMommy’spodcast.

ThispodcastisbroughttoyoubyFourSigmatic.There’ssomuchIloveaboutthiscompany,forinstancetheirfounder,Tero,forhimforagingandgrowinglocalfoodsisapassionthatgoesbackgenerationsasheisa13th-generationfarmerfromFinland,wheretheydothingsalittlebitdifferently.Terofoundawaytoincorporatehighlybeneficialsuperfoodmushroomsintoeverydaybeverageslikecoffee,matchaandsuperfoodelixirssowecanallsipthemeverydayandgetthemanybenefits.Forinstance,didyouknowthatoneservingofChagamushroomscontainsasmuchantioxidantsas30poundsofcarrots,andthatChagamushroomsareconsideredthemostantioxidantrichfoodonearthgramforgram?FourSigmaticcoffeehasbeenmygo-tooncoffeedaysforyearssinceithasbeneficialLionsManeorCordycepsforanextrabrainboostwithoutthejitters,andIconsumeoneoftheircoffeesorelixirseveryday.IalsooftenendthedaywiththeirReishiElixirwhichhelpspromoterestfulsleep.Youcancheckouttheirfullrangeofproductsandgraba15%discountbygoingto foursigmatic.com/wellnessmama andusingthecodewellnessmama.ThispodcastissponsoredbyThriveMarket…IhavebeenorderingfromThriveforyearsandsavinghundredsofdollarsayearbydoingso,becauseIliveabout20milesfromthenearestbig-ishcityandfrommostbiggrocerystores.IshoplocalforourproduceandmeatsofcoursebuttosavetimeandtrafficIgetmostofournon-perishablesfromThriveMarket.Everymonth,Iorderacoupleofbigboxesthathaveallofourstaplesforthemonthlikecondiments,almondbutter,grainfreecrackers,coconutaminos,spices,bakingingredients,plantainchips,maplesyrup,tomatoproducts,pastasauceandmore.SinceThriveislikeCostcomeetsWholeFoodsonline,thisallowsourfamilytosavealotofmoneyeachmonthandeachyear,whilealwaysbeingstockedonthefoodswelove.Justforlisteningtothispodcast,youcangetanextra25%offyourfirstorderplusafree30daymembershiptoThriveMarketat thrivemarket.com/katie. Heather:Hi,welcometo"TheWellnessMamaPodcast."ThisisHeatherwithwellnessmama.com.

Katie:AndI'mKatiefromwellnesssmama.com.

Katie:Gotit.So,wethoughtitwouldbeappropriateforthe200thepisodetorecapsomeofthetoptakeawaysfromthelast100episodessinceIdidarecapatthe100thepisode.Butalso,wethoughtitwouldbereallyfittingbasedonourownrecentbignewsandfeedbackwe'vegottenfromyouguystoalsotalkaboutwhatwethinkisprobablythemostimportantfactorwhenitcomestohealth,andwe'vesaiditbefore,andthat'scommunity.Becauseit'ssomethingthatreallyhasbeendrivenhomeforbothofuspersonallyinthelastcoupleofweeks,andwewantedtosharealittlebitofourstoryandkindofanupdatefromthegroundintheaftermathofHurricaneMichael,andalsojusttalkaboutthelessonsthatwe'reseeinghereonthegroundandtherealbeautyofthat.So,Heather,doyouwannakindagiveanoverviewofwhat'shappenedinourlivesthelastcoupleofweeks?

Heather:Sure.Well,Iannouncedon"Mommypotamus"thatIwasmovingoverto"WellnessMama,"andyouandIwouldbeco-bloggingthere.AndoneofthethingsImentionedinthatpostisthatlonelinessisahigherriskfactorthanobesity,smoking,andhighbloodpressure,youknow,intermsofitseffectonourhealth.Andthatcanbetrueevenifwedon'tnecessarilyfeellonely,whichIthinkalotofusreallymaybedon'trealize,thatwegothroughperiodswherewe'regettingmostofourconnectionviasocialmedia.AndI'mdefinitelyinfavorofthat,I'monsocialmediaquiteabit.

Buthavingrealpeopleinyourlifethatcancomedigyououtofaholeisalsoreallyimportant.Because,Idon'tknow,notallpeoplehavethesamestyleofcommunication,butwhenIgetreallystressed,Istopcommunicating.Ikindofgointernalandfocusinwardandstopaskingforhelp.Andso,havingpeopleinmylifewhorecognizethatinme...Iknowyou'vedonethisbefore,Katie,you'vebeenlike"You'regoingtolunchwithmethisweek,"youknow.Gettingmeoutandhelpingmeseethingsinadifferentlightisoneaspect.


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There'slikealmostasafetynettohavingpeopleinyourreallifewhocanseethosesignswhenyou'reunabletocommunicatethem.Thatisn'tpossibleasmuchwithsocialmedia.

So,allthattosaywehadthatopportunityoverthispastweektoexperienceourcommunityonadeeperlevel,becausewebothendedupevacuatingaheadofthehurricane.Andweallevacuatedtogetherwithfamilyand...well,friends,notfamily,andwewereallkindofwaitingtohearnewsaboutwhetherornotwewouldhavehomestocomehometo,butitwasaninterestingexperience.I'mgonnaletyousharealittlebitaboutithere.

Katie:Yeah,itwasdefinitely...itreallystruckmethelastcoupleofweeksseeingbothsidesofthat.So,likeyousaid,weboth,ourfamiliesandsomefriendsalsoallhadtoevacuate,andweendedupinthesameplaceafewhoursaway,basicallyjustrentinghotelrooms,andbunkeringdownwithbasicsupplies.Andtheironywasjustseeingthehurricanebuild.Becauseoriginally,like,ourareatypicallydoesnotgethithardbyhurricanes,nobodywasreallyworried.Iknowthefirsttwodays,wereallyknewitwasgonnaprobablyhitus.Iwasstill,like,"Oh,we'renotgonnaevacuate.It'sjustahurricane,it'sfine."

Andthenanevacuationsuggestioncameoutandwe'relike,"Ithinkwe'restillokay."Andthenamandatoryevacuationorderwasreleased,whichbasicallymeans,ifyoustay,youwilllikelynothavewater,orpower,becausetheyoftenturnthoseoffproactively,andemergencyservicesarenotgoingtocomegetyouinthemidstofthehurricaneifsomethinggoeswrong.Soreally,atthatpoint,werealizedwithkidsyouhavetogetoutatthatpoint.Andthatwas...eventhen,Idon'tthinkwefullyrealizedwhatwemightbefacing,becauseIthinkatthatpoint,itwasstillconsideredacategorytwoormaybeitwasgoingtobeathreewhenweactuallyleft.Andthenovertheperiodofthenext24hours,itescalatedtoacategory4,andeventhereweregroundreportsofitregisteringcategory5winds,whichhadneverhitthisarea.

AndIthinkifI'mrememberingbythetimeitwasallsaidanddone,itendedupbeingthethirdworsthurricanetoeverhittheUnitedStates,basedonwindspeedandpressureattimeoflandfall.Andbecauseofthat,weleftrelativelyquickly.Iknowwebasicallytookafewdays’worthofclothes,andforus,likeourlaptops,thingsthatwereneededforwork,andafewthingsthatwerereallyirreplaceable.

Butthatwasthefirstinterestingmomentformewasrealizingaswewereleaving...andatthatpoint,westillprettymuchthoughtwe'dhaveahometocomebacktohopefullywhenitwasstilljustacategorytwo.ButlikehavingtothinkthroughwhatthingsareactuallymostimportantthatIwannatakethemwithme,anditreallyendedupbeingfewerthingsthanIanticipated.Butthenoncewehadevacuated,anditwasincreasing,therebecameamuchmorerealchancethatthedevastationwasgoingtobeworsethanwethought.

Andsittinginthathotelandkindofwatchingonthenewsandcontinuingtogetthesealertsonourphonethatsoundlikeamberalerts,butthey'rehurricanealerts,andjustthatwholeprocess,reallyreinforcedjusthowimportantandhowlife-changingcommunityis.BecauseIcan'timagine,andIknowtherewerepeopletherewhowere,butIcan'timaginefacingthatalone.Ican'timaginesittinginthosehallways,waitingforupdates,feelingverypowerless,whichIthinkisalessoninandofitself.Buttruly,justbeingatthemercyofthatstormandhavingtobeokaywiththefactthattheremightbenothingleftwhenwewenthome.

AndIknowwe'rebothsupergratefulthatwegottogohometoourhomesandtherewasminimaldamage.Butforsomeofourneighborsjustafewmilesaway,thatwasnotthecase.Andhavingnowbeentomorethecenterofwhereithit,ittrulylookslikeabombwentoff.Ican'tevenreallyputintowordswhatitlookslike,it'shorrific.It'soneofthemosthorrificthings.IwentandhelpedafterHarveyandKatrinawhenIwasyounger,andthedevastationwassimilar,butsomeoftheareasherearemoregroundzeroofwherethestormhitandareevenworsethanwhatIsawduringthosestorms.


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Iwasn’tatgroundzeroforthose.Butjustseeingthedevastationandseeingthingslikekidswalkingaroundwithnoshoesinrustymetal,orsplinteredtrees,orlikeoursweetmailmanforourneighborhood,ourkidsall,like,lovehimandhavemadefriendswithhim,andatreefellonhishome.Andhestillhadtokeepworkingbecause,inordertohavemoneytorepairhishome,hehadtohaveincome.Andhiswifewasevenhelpinghimonhisroute,andtheyhadtoleavetheirhomeinordertodothat.Andthere'sarealpossibilityoflootingatthispoint.

Andso,alotofpeoplefromourneighborhoodwentandhelpedgetthetreeoffhishouseandhelpedboarditbackupsohishomecouldatleastbesafe.Andjustseeingthebeautyofthat,Ithinkthat'swhatreallyhasstruckmesomuchtheselastcoupleofweeks.It'sjustunfortunatelyhowoftenittakessomethingthishorribletobringoutthebestinpeople,butalsohowamazingitiswhenyouseethat,whenyouseethewholecommunitycometogether,andformthesebondsandpitchinregardlessofpolitics,orrace,orreligion,oranydifferencesthatseemsounimportantatthatpoint,andjustpeoplebringingfoodtoeachother,andgivinganythingthatyoucan.

Iknowwe'vesentourgenerator,we'vesenttarps,we'vesentfood,andwaterandtoiletries,anddiapers,anddogfood.It'sjustbeensostrikingtoseethebeautyofthatcommunityrisingup,andit'salsoreallystruckmepersonally.Ialreadyknewfromtheresearchthehealthreasonsonwhycommunityissoimportant,andIknewfromthingslikeourfriendship,Iknewjusthowpersonallyimportantthosethingswere.Buttorealizesittinginthathotelwithallofusthatwetrulycouldloseeverythingphysicalthatweowned,butattheendoftheday,that'snottheimportantstuff.Anditwould,ofcourse,bealongprocesstorebuild,butthatattheendoftheday,thatwasokay,becauseevenifthatwasgonnahappen,weweregonnafaceittogether.

So,we'reverygratefulthatwedidn'thavetofacelossofourhomes,andIknowwe'rebothalsoverygratefulthatwenowhaveaplacetobeabletoofferassistancetoothersandtobringpeopleinwhentheyneedfood.andtobeabletosendanythingthatwehave,becausecertainlysomanywerenotsolucky.ButIwishIcouldevenputitintowordsbetterjusthowdeeplyitstruckmeinthatmoment,sittinginthathotel,justliterallywaitingtoseeifourhomewouldbeokay,justhowimportantthatcommunitypiecefeltwheneverythingelsemightdisappear.

Heather:Yeah,definitely,andtherewasnotawholelotofsleepthroughoutthenight.SoIrememberIwakeupat2:00,3:00,4:00,5:00,andI'mcheckingtheforecastsandwe'relookingatthesevery,verysmallfractionalthings.Buteverythingfeelssodifferentinthatmoment,andyet,thecommunitythatwehave,itwasamazinghowitheldustogetherinways,ourchildrenwereallplayingtogether.Andwhenthingsarereallydifficult,it'seasytogetsnappy,ifyou'reunderalotofstressyou'retryingtomaybehandlealotofhigh-levelstuff.Maybeyou'retryingtocoordinatelargerstuff.

Andwhenyouhaveacommunitytogether,itgelsinsuchabeautifulway.Like,ourkidswereplaying,wewereabletodothethingsthatweneededtodo.Andyouknow,ourkidsstillthinkthatwekindofwentonaspecialtrip,because,Idon'tknow,itjustbroughtoutwhatwasmostimportantwhichwasbeingtogetherandbeingsafe.ButyouandIbothtalkedalotbecauseyoumentionedlootingwhichisreallysad.Andit'seasytojudge,I'mnotsayingthatthere'sarightorwrongineverysinglecircumstance.Sometimespeoplearelegitimatelylookingforveryimportantsuppliesorfood,or,youknow...becausetheirsituationisreallydesperateinsomeareas.So,I'mnotheretomakeablanketstatement.Ithinkthatsometimestragedieslikethis,theybringouttheverybestandtheveryworst.

Communitiescankindofbedefinedbyasharedhopeor,youknow,sharingourgreatestfears.Andthesetypesofsituationstendtobringoutboth.Butitisreallybeautifulwhenpeoplecometogether.AndyouandIhavebeentryingtokindoffigureoutwhatitisthathasbroughtsomuchofasenseofkindnessand


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community,andwekindacameupwithacoupleofthings.Onebeingthatnormallifeissuspended,andsoyouknow,whenwe'reoutofourdaytoday,itgivesusanopportunitytoseethingsfromadifferentperspective,andtoseepeoplefromadifferentperspective.

Katie:Yeah,Ithinkthat'saninterestingthingtoo,likeeventhetimewewereinthehotelorcertainlynow,thingsarenotdefinitelybacktonormaloranywhereclose.Eventhoughourhomesareokaynow,therearestillsomuchinfrastructuregoingon.AndIthinkanytimethere'sapatterninterruptithelpsyoutoworkthroughthings,butespeciallyanythingonthislevel.Onaveryreallevel,like,Iknowwetalkedaboutalittlebit,likewhenyou'renotarguingabouttakingupthetrashbecausethere'snotrashtotakeout,orwhenit'smoreoflikegettingshelteroveryourhead,takingcareofthosebasichumanneeds.You'reabletohavethatcommonfocusandtoworkthroughthenormalthings,ratherthangettingstuckinthosedaytodayhassles.

Heather:Right,becauseinsomewayswe'resharingacommonthreatorenemy,youknow,becausetheenemyisnothavingahometosleepin,or,youknow,beingexposedinthosekindsofthings.Soitdefinitelydoesbringpeopletogether.Andthat'snottosaythattakingoutthetrashisn'tanimportantpartofbeingpartofthecommunity,itis...Imeanwhenweallshareresponsibilities,that'sabigpartofit.Butbeingtakenoutofthat,shakingthingsupcangiveyouadifferentperspective.

Andalso,Ithinkinthispodcastwe'regonnatalkabout,youknow,what'sgettinginthewayofcommunityallthetime.Like,howcanwebringsomeofthethingsfromaneventlikethisintoourdailylivestomakeourdailylivesbetter?So,what'sgettinginthewayandhowcanwefostercommunity?AnotheroneIthinkthatwebothtalkedaboutwasjustthatthisistheultimateinvulnerability.It'snotpossibletoreallybeincommunitywithoutvulnerability,butnobodyreallylikestohavetodothat.It'shard,it'salwayshard.

Buthere,inthisparticulartimeandplace,vulnerabilityisnotoptional.We'reallvulnerablebecausewefeelitat,like,aprimallevel.Andso,whenpeoplecomethroughforyouandwhenpeoplearethereforeachother,itbringsoutanamazingsenseofloveandkindnessthatwedon'tnecessarilyexperienceinday-to-daylife,becausewehavemoreshields.Nowthat'snottosaythatthosearenecessarilybadallthetime.Like,wedon'tnecessarilyneedtobevulnerableatTargetat3:00intheafternoon,like,withwhoeverisjustwalkingby.Butwedoneedtohavepeopleinourlivesthatwecanbevulnerablewithonaregularbasis.It'sessentialforourownpersonalhealth.

Katie:Yeah,Ithinkthisissuchanimportantpointbecausethat'swhatyouandIhavebeensortofwrestlingwiththeselastfewdays,iswhydoesittakedisasters?Like,whydowehavetohavehorriblethingshappentobringouttheseamazinghumantraits?Andwhyisitthatinthosetimes,itseemssoeasytopitchin,andtohelpourneighbor,andtoloveeachother,andtoignorethosesmallthingsthatdon'tseemimportant?Andisthereawaytodothatwithouthavingtogothroughahurricane,orafire,oranearthquake,oratornado,oranykindofhorrificevent?Canwefigureouthowtobringthosethingsintoourdailylives?

AndIknowonethingthatyouandIhavebothreadalotaboutinthelastcoupleofyears,andit'sincreasinglyimportantandincreasinglystilldifficult,doesn'tgeteasyjustbecauseyouknowit'simportant,butisvulnerability.Andyoumentionedthatthat'soneofthekeycomponentsofrealcommunity,andIthinkthat'salsooneofthehardesttoovercome.Ithinkintoday'sworld,there'ssomuchofafocusonbeingindependent,andbeingstrong,andbeingabletotakecareofyourself,which,again,thosearenotbadthings,buttheyhavetobebalancedwithvulnerability,andbeingabletobereal,andtobevulnerablewiththosethatyoulove.AndIthinkwhenitcomestohavingtroublebuildingcommunitythatcanbeoneofthebiggeststrugglestogetthrough,isbecauseittakesaconsciouseffortintoday'sworldtobevulnerable.


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Ithinkotherthingsjustinnormallife,we'resobusyintoday'sworld,andIknowwe'vetalkedaboutthisinpastepisodesofjustcreatingmoretimeandmorebandwidthforfamilytime,fordowntime,forunstructuredfreeplaytime.ButIfeellikethisbusynessandoverwhelmissuchanenemyofcommunity,becauseitmakesitlogisticallydifficulttoevenhavetimetobuildrelationships.Butalso,justthatmentalstress,itmakesithardtobevulnerable,itmakesithardtorelatetopeople,andthat'sareallydifficultthingtoovercomeinnormallife.

Andthat'sanotherthingthatrightnowissuspended,becauseinthefaceofadisaster,there'snotthenormalextracurricularactivitiesandyou'renotrunningtoschool,you'retakingcareofyourbasichumanneeds.Andoneofthoseneedsthatbecomessomuchmoreprominentistheneedforotherpeopleandforrelationship.Doyouwannatalkaboutsocialmedia?Iknowthat'sonewe'vealsotalkedaboutinrelationtohowitaffectscommunity.

Heather:Yeah,Imean,Ithink,asIsaidearlier,I'mahugefanofsocialmedia,I'monsocialmediaalot.Butit'seasytocuratethereinawaythatunfortunatelydoesn'talwaysserveuswell.Andifyou'reonlycultivatingrelationships,atleastinmyownexperience,whenIwasonlyprimarilycultivatingrelationshipsonline,thenwhenthingsgotreallyhard,whenmyhusbandandIargued,ImeanIdidn'tgopostthat.Butwhatyoudoyouneedisasoundingboard,somebodytotalkthroughthingsandthatcanhelpyoushiftaperspective,orgrow,orallkindsofthings.

Andthethingis,Idon'tthinkIrealizedhowlonelyIwastruly,orhowaloneIwas,orhowvulnerableIwasinaparticularlyhardsituation,nothavingthesupportthatIneededuntilIstartedreallyexperiencingcommunity.AndIthought,"Oh,gosh,thisislikeacomplete...thisisatotallydifferentexperience."Becausewhenhardthingshappen,andtheydotoallofus,there'sasupport,there'ssomethingaroundyouthathelpsyouholdyourselftogether.Thosepeopledon'tholdyoutogether,buttheybelieveinyou,theyremindyoutohope,andtheystaywithyouthroughit,anditmakesallthedifference.

AndIdon'tthinkwecaneverhaveaconversationaboutcommunityandvulnerabilitywithoutbringingupBrenéBrown.AndoneofthebiggesttakeawaysIhadintermsofreallyjustlookingbackandfindinghowImadeitfromapersonwhodidn'treallyexperiencetruecommunitytosomeonewhoisreallysurroundedbypeoplewhoaremypeople,isthatI'msurprisedatwhothosepeopleturnedouttobe.They'renotallthepeoplewithwhomIagreeoneverythingorshareexactlythesamevalues,orthesamesenseofhumor,orreallylikeanythinginsomecases.

SoBrenéBrownhasastorythatshetellsaboutherdaughterthatreally,Ithink,describes,like,howwecanidentifythosepeopleinourlivesthatarethebeginningsofcommunity.So,ifyou'rethinkingtoyourself,like,"Thatsoundsreallygood,butIhavenoideawhothatpersonwouldbeinmylife."Ilovethisstoryfromher.Shebasicallysaidthatherdaughterwalksthroughthefrontdoorfromschooloneday,closesthedoor,andslidesagainstthedoor,justkindacrumblesonthefloor.AndBrenéislike,"What'sgoingon?"Basically,somethinghumiliatinghadhappenedtoher,Ibelieve,atschool,andshehadtoldacoupleofclosefriendsaboutit,theypromisednottotell.Andthen,youknow,bythenextperiodorshortlyafterthat,everyoneintheclassknew.Andthehumiliationlevelwashigh,andshefeltsobetrayed.

Andtheteacher,Iguess,hassomemarblesinajarthatsortofcollectivelyreflectstheattitudeofclass,orlike,youknow,whatthey...It'ssortofabarometerofthedirectionoftheclass.Andshetookhalfthemarblesoutofthejar,likeshewasreallyupsetaboutthelevelofhumiliationthislittlegirlwasexperiencing.Andso,thelittlegirltellsBrené,shesaid,"I'mjustnevergonnatrustanyoneagain,likenevereverdoingthat."AndIthinkwe'veallhadthatmomentwherewegetburned,Imeanit'saninevitablepartofbeingvulnerable.


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Andyouknow,asamom,you'relike,"Yeah!"untilyourealizelike,"Butthat'sareallylonelylife."SoverywiselyBrenésays,youknow,"Thatmarblejar...Youknow,doyouhaveanyfriendswhohave..."I'mtryingtoremembertheconceptofthemarblejar,butit'sreallyaboutnotbehaviorandsortofarewardsense,butlikeareflectionoftheinvestments.Youknow,"Doyouhaveanyonewhohasinvestedinyourlifewhohasfilledthatmarblejarforyou?"Andshesaid,"Yeah,like,myfriendthatremembers..."youknow,Ican'trememberwhatthegrandparentsname,"Mimiandpapa'sname."She'slike"Well,whatelse?"Andshe'slike,"Ohthat'sit,it'sjustthatIhaveeightgrandparents,and,youknow,forsomeonetotakethetimetorememberallmygrandparents'namesreallymeansalottome."

Andthenshesaid,"Well,doyouhaveanyother,youknow,marblejarfriends,peoplewhohavereallyinvestedinyou,whohaveshownupforyou?"She'slike,"Ohyeah,"Ithinkshecallsitherhalfbuttfriend.Butshe'slike,"What'sahalfbuttfriend?"Andshe'slike"Well,youknow,whenIshowuptolunchandthetableisalreadyfull,sheshareshalfherseatwithme,andweputhalfofourcheeksontheseatsothatIdon'thavetosit,youknow,somewhereelseorsitalone."AndI'mlike,"Yeah,tomethatsoundslikeamarblejarfriend."

Butweallhavepeopleinourliveswhoshowupforusevenwhenwedon'tnecessarilyagreeorshareeverysameperspective.And,youknow,youandIhaveacommunityoffriendsthatsortofwasrandomlyselectedatthebeginning.Wedidn'tactuallyknowwhatwehadincommonorwhatweshared,butwejustkindofstartedshowinguponaregularbasisandholdingourselvestothatstandard.Andwefoundthethingsthatformconnection,butitwaskindoflikea...Wedidn'tknowitwastheretillwetrieditout,anditjustgrew.So,inchoosingcommunity,Ithinkit'simportantjusttoseewho'salreadyaroundyouandsortoflikecultivatethat.

Katie:Yeah,absolutely.AndIthinkit'ssomething,liketothepointyoujustmentioned,it'ssomethingsoimportantalsotomodelforourkidsandforthenextgeneration.Becauseiflonelinessisthisepidemicthat'sfacingusrightnowwithwhatwecurrentlyhavewithtechnologyandsocialmedia,that'snotgoingtolessenforourkids.They'regonnahavetoreallyhaveskillstoworkthroughthisandtodevelopactualrelationships.Andthatwastheotherthingwereallywantedtomakesurewecouldfigureouthowtotalkabouttoday,washowcanwefoster,allofusinourownlives,howcanwebuildcommunityhopefullywithouthavingtogothroughsomethinghorrible?

Wecertainlyhopenoneofyouguyseverhavetogothroughahurricaneorthroughanydisaster,buthowcanwetakethelessonsofthatandbringthemintoourdailylifetobuildcommunity?Because,asyoumentioned,thatlonelinessissostatisticallyimportant,andwefeelthattoo.Butontheflipside,having...let'ssee,IthinkIfoundonestatisticthathavingstrongcommunityandsocialconnectionleadstoa50%increasedchanceoflongevity.Itstrengthenstheimmunesystem,ithelpsusrecoverfromdisease.

Peoplewhohavestrongconnectionshavelowerratesofanxietyanddepression.They'remoreempathetic,they'remoretrusting,they'remoregenerous,prettymuchallthingsthatwewanttohaveinourlives.Andiftherewasasupplementoranexerciseprogramthatdidthat,wewouldallbejumpingintodoit.Sojustrealizinghowimportant,liketrulyIcan'temphasizeenough,ifthere'sonethingthatyou'regoingtodoforyourhealth,startwithpeople,andstartwithrelationshipsandcommunity.It'smoreimportantthanwhatyoueat,it'smoreimportantthanyourexercise,it'smoreimportantthanyoursleep,whichishuge,becauseyouguysknowhowmuchwevaluesleepandhowwekeepdrivingthatpointintothegroundofhowimportantsleepis.

Andso,tothatpoint,Iknowwewantedtokindofwalkthroughourownwaythatwefoundcommunityandtrytopullsomepointsthatcanworkacrosstheboard.Likediet,ofcourse,there'spersonalizedaspects,andeverycommunitywilllookdifferent.ButIthinkthereareuniversalthingsthatcanhelpbuildthose


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relationshipsandthosesocialconnections.And,toyourpoint,Ithinkvulnerabilityiswhereitstarts.AndIloveBrenéBrown,IknowyouloveBrenéBrowntoo,andwe'lllinkherbooksintheshownotes.Definitelycan'trecommendthemenough,IknowshehasanewoneoutthatIhaven'treadyet,butit'sonmyKindle.ButIthinkthatthattakesaconsciouseffort,andwehavetobewillingtoletourguarddownandtobevulnerable.Andthatopensusuptothepotentialtobehurt,becausetrulywhenyou'revulnerable,that'swhenyoucanmostbehurt,butthat'salsowhenyoucanmostbeloved.

Andso,youhavetobewillingtoletthatguarddown,andtodothathopefullyinawaywithpeoplewhoyoucantrustandwhoaregoingtobuildyouupinthattimeofvulnerability.AndIthinkpartofthattooisaconsciousefforttochoosetoseethebestinotherpeopleandinyourself.Andthat,atleastspeakingfrommyownperspective,choosingtoseethebestinmyselfisthehardestsometimes.It'seasytofindthebestinotherssooften,andIholdmyselftosuchatougherstandard,andI'msomuchharderonmyself.Iknowthat'sprobablyaprettycommonthemeamongwomen.

Butonebookthatreallyhelpedmewiththisrecently,Imentioneditinpassingonanotherepisode,it'scalled"TheFourAgreements."Andit'sareallyshorteasyread,andit'sbasicallyaboutsubtleshiftstothesefouragreementsyoumakewithyourselfthatovertimechangeyourthoughtprocessandhowyouinteractwithpeople.Andthefouragreementsarebasically,first,tobeimpeccablewithyourword.Andthatmeansinspeakingtootherpeople,butalsoinyourself-talkandalsoinyouractions.Justbeingimpeccable,soonthebasiclevelwithwhatyousayyou'regonnado,youdoit,whatyousayyou'renotgonnado,youdon't.

Butalso,beingtruthfulwhenyouspeaktoyourselfandnotbeingharshonyourself,orderogatorytowardyourselfortowardothers.Becausecertainly,whenwespeaknegativelyaboutothers,itbringsusdowntoo.Thesecondpartofitbeing,don'ttakeanythingpersonally,andIthinkthataloneispartiallytheantidotetothesocialmediaworld.BecauseIseesooftenandI'mcertainlyguiltyofhavingdonethisinthepastaswell,fallingintothattrapofneedingtoberight,andtoargueapoint,andgettingsoupsetwhensomeonehasadifferingviewpoint.Becauseweseeitas...itbringsupfearinus,Ithink,andinsecurity.Andifwereallyfaceit,itmakesusquestionourviewpoint,whichisagreatthingifwe'rebraveenoughtodoit.

Buttonottakeanythingpersonallyandrealizethatsooftenwhatotherpeopledoandsayiscomingfromaplacethat...somewherethattheyneedtoworkonorthatthey'regoingthrough.Andsomanytimesthat'saplaceoffear,orpain,orinsecurity.Andratherthanrespondinginanger,ifwecanrespondinempathyandcompassion,wecanhelpthemworkthroughthat,andactuallybringbothofustoabetterlevelandtoastrongerrelationshipversushavingtheneedtoprovethatwe'reright,evenifweactuallythinkweareright.Wetypicallydon'tgainmuchbyprovingthat.

Thethirdpointbeingnotmakingexcuses,andIthinkthat'salsoareallyhardonebecauseit'shardtoadmit,especiallyifwehaven'tdonesomethingperfectlythatwedidn'tdoitperfectlyandnotmakeanexcuseforwhyortrytojustifythat.That'swhenIknowIevencatchmyselfonalot.Andthenfinally,alwaysdoyourbest.AndIthinkthat'sagoodexampleoftheonlystandardwecantrulyholdourselfto.Becausethat'sonedownfallIseethatyouhavetobecarefulofwhenyoureallystartengagingincommunity,isthereisatemptationtocompareyourselftootherpeopleortojudgeyourselfwiththemasabarometer.

Andattheendoftheday,allwecanreallyjudgeourselfagainstisourownactionsthedaybeforeandgettingbetterinourownlifedaybyday.Andsothosejustfoursimpleruleshavebeeneasy,likeagoodmetricformetostartmeasuringby,andIthinktheycanbehelpfulintryingtoworkthroughthoserelationshipsandtobuildthem.


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Heather:Absolutely.Andonthatnote,IthinkyouandIweretalkingaboutthisearlier.Sometimesyoujust...especiallywhenitcomesdowntobeingright,that'sdefinitelysomethingthatIstrugglewithaswell,askmyhusband.ButmyhusbandandIwere...ourkidsweregoingcompletelybonkersafewdaysago,andobviously,they'vebeenvery,verycoopedupbecauseofallthat'sbeengoingon.Andtheywerejustkindof...theywereallbouncingoffthewallsanditwasreally,reallyhard.AndIsaidIthinkweneedtogetthemoutofthehouseandletthemrun.Andhisresponsewaskindoflike,definitelylikemoreofa...likeanormalliferesponse,waslike,"Idon'tknowthatweshouldrewardthis.Likethey'reactingcrazy,shouldwereallytakethemout?LikeIdon'twantthemtostartthinkingthatthisisthewaytogetwhattheywant."

AndIsaid,"Ifeellikeatthisexactmoment,wejustneedtoassumethatwe'realldoingthebestwecanandchoosetheperspectivethat,let'ssee,assumesthebestinus,andjustsortofactwiththat.”So,weendedupgettingthemoutofthehouse,lettingthemrun,anditwassogoodforourfamily.Butit'ssoeasy,like,inalmostanysituation,multipleperspectivesarevalidorcanbevalid.Andsometimesitcomesdowntojustchoosingtheonethathonorstheconnectionandjustassumesthebest.Anditcanbereallyhardtodoifit'ssomethingyoureallycareabout.

Like,Ireallycareaboutsilencesometimeswhenlifehasbeenreallychallengingandstuff,like,mynerveswerealittlefrayedatthemoment,anditwashard.Butunderstandingthateveryoneisdoingthebesttheycandefinitelyservedusallwell.Wegotthemout,theyran,itwasgood.Sothat'sjust,onthesubjectofbeingrightorchoosingwhat'smostconducivetorelationship.Let'sseehere,doyouwannatalkabouteverythingwillworkoutperfectly?

Katie:Yeah,actuallythisisashoutouttomynewfriendTina,from...she'soneofthepeoplethatfoundedJustThriveProbiotics,whichistheprobioticthatI'vebeenusing.AndwhenI'vegottentospendtimewithherinreallife,shehasthismottothatshealwaysturnsto,whichisthateverythingwillworkoutperfectly.Andthatmaynotmeanthateverythingwillworkouttheeasiestwayorthewaywewantitto,butjustit'sareminderthateverythingwillworkout.Andit'shermottothatshesaysespeciallyintoughtimes.

Andtheironyis,atleastfromtheoutside,herlifedoesseemtoalwaysworkout.Andit'soneofthosechickenoreggtypethings,doesherlifeworkoutbecauseshe'salwayspositive,andshe'slookingforthegood.Or,youknow,likeisthatsomethingshe'sconsciouslydoing,orisitjustshe'skeepingthepositivefocus,soeverythingseemsgood?Butit'sbeensomethingthat'sbeenhelpfulformeinthelastfewweekssinceIspenttimewithher,isjustkeepingthatfocuseveninthemidstofallthecrazinessrightnowofjustlikeeverythingwillworkoutperfectly.Andin10years,thisstuffisnotgonnamatter,andpeoplewillrebuild,andwe'llbeheretohelpthemhopefullyduringthatwholeprocess.

ButjustIthinkthatthepointthereiskeepingthepositiveinmindbecauseIthinkwhatwelookforwewillfindoften.Andifwe'realwayslookingforthenegative,we'llcertainlyfinditintoday'sworld.Butifwe'relookingforthepositiveandwereassumingthebesttogobacktotheearlierpoint,Ithinkthenthathappensaswell.Andattheveryleast,wearehappierpeople,ifthat'sourfocus,evenifnoteverythinginlifegoesourwayoriseasy,it'sjusteasiertofindthegoodinwhateverhappenswhenyoukeepthatfocus.

Heather:Yes,soonethingIwantedtokindofmentionwasjustsomethingsthatwe'vedoneovertimethathasactuallystrengthenedthebonds,andthetrustbetweenourfriendshipcircle.So,likeIsaid,wesortofjustpickednotrandom,butlike,peoplewhojustkindofsaid,"You'remypeople,"andthenwesortofwentfromthereandbuiltitout.AndoneofthethingsthatI'venoticedlookingbackistherearealotofwaystodothis.SomefamiliesIknow,like,havefourorfivefamilies,theydoFridaynightdinners,andtheyreally...likethetablesalldeckedout,theyreallymakeitspecial.AndtheygettogetherlikeeveryFridaynight,they'redoinglifetogether.Andotherpeople,youknow,like,theycamptogether.


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Someofthethingsthatwe'vedoneare,well,westartedwithmealslikeonceamonth,andwehadtodriveandplan,and,youknow,itwasalottomakeitwork,butwedid.Andthenweactuallyplannedafewtripswithotherfamiliesandtheywereclosewithindrivingdistance,andkindofbudget-friendlyyouknow.Butwegottogetherandliterallyspenttime.AndIrememberduringoneofthosetripswegota...I'llhavetogetthelist.Buttherewasthatlistof...they'resupposedtobeicebreakerquestions,butwe'vebeenfriendsforyearsatthispoint.Andyet,whenyoureallygettothatplacewhereyou'reansweringthesequestionsin,like,atrueandhonestandvulnerableway,like,thepeopleinyourlife,youcanreallylearntoappreciateandseetheminanewlight.Anditisreallyamazingtogettodothat,weshouldpostthoseicebreakerquestionsbecausethey'rereallyfun.

Andthen,oneofourfavoritethingsistodohardthingstogether.OneofthehilariousthingsthatyouandIhavealwaysdoneisifwewalkbysomething,oranopportunitycomesuptowhatstand...whatisthecryotank,like,negative220?So,you'relike"Let'sgostandinacryotankthat'slikenegative220degrees,"andI'mlike“thatsoundsterrible…absolutely!”Becausewhenyougothroughthosethingswhenevenyou,youchoosetodohardthingstogether,thenitbringsyoutogetherbecausethere'sjustalevelofconnection.Andso,youknow,wehopethatlikeKatiesaidearlierthat,youknow,thatwedon'texperiencethekindsoftragedythatsomanyofourneighborshaverecently.Butalso,wechoosetobechallengedandwechoosetochallengeourselves.

LikeIthinkyouandI,bothofourkidswannado5Ksrecently.They'relike,"Hey,mom,canwedoa5K?"AndIwasliterallylike,"Idon'tknow,canIdoa5K?"Imean,"Ido,Istayfitandstuff,but,like,canIreallyruna5K?Idon'tknow."So,youandIarebothlike"Wellwecan'tletourkids,like,outshineus,"sowe'rebothdoinga5know.Butyouknow,it'slikenoplanningwe'rejustgonnadoit.Andlettingchallengebeoneofthedefiningaspectsofourrelationshiphasbeenlikewhatkindofpullsustogether,becausewehavetoworktogetherto,like,accomplishgoals.

Canyouthinkofanythingelseourfriends...likewedomealstogetherwithourextendedcommunity.Iknowwejustdidonerecentlyinayardlikeabigneighborhoodmeal,andthatwasreallyfun.Butwhataresomeotherthingsthatwe'vedonethatinapracticaltermhavebroughtusclosertothepeople,andtheneighbors,andjustthepeopleinourlives?

Katie:Yeah,Ithinkyouhitthenailontheheadwithjustprioritizingtime.IknowIoftensaythatattheendofpodcastinterviews,Ithankpeopleforsharingtheirmostvaluableasset,whichistheirtimewithus.Andthat'ssotrueinreallifeaswell.Andtoemphasizeyourpoint,becauseIthinkitcanbehardtofindyourpeople,andthatwassomethingthatIreallystruggledwithforyears.AndIfeellikeI'mapersonwhocangetalongwithanybody,butIhavetroubleopeningupandtrustingandbeingvulnerable,becauseofpastexperiences,likeBrenéBrown'sdaughter.

Andsothathasbeenthestruggleforme,andwhenwestartedourgroup,Iknowwe'vementioneditbefore,butweliterallyhaveagroupoffamiliesthatprettymuchinthebeginningtheonlycommonalitywasthatweallwereinthisonlineworldtogether.Andwesortofpickedeachotheroutofobscurityandwerelike,"Hey,we'regonnameetupatahouse,andwe'regonnabringallourkids,andwe'regonnajusthavecommunityandmastermindandwe'regonnahelpeachother."AndtheironythereisitwasactuallyareactiontoanothereventthatIhadbeentobeforethat,whereIhadanursingbabywhowassupertinyandquiet,andtheybasicallytoldmeIwasn'twelcometherebecauseshewaswithme,andshewasn'tdisturbingoranything.

Andsothatwaspartofourthinginthebeginning,waswe'regonnacreateaverysmalleventwherefamiliesarewelcome,andnotjustwelcome,butthey'recelebrated,andthey'renurtured.Because,Ifeellikewe'realltornwhateverwedoinourlivesasourjobs,orourcareers,andthenourfamilies,werealwayssotorn


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betweenthose.Andespecially,asawoman,Icansayit'shardwhenI'mworking,IfeelguiltythatI'mnotwithmykids,butIalsofeelthisdrivetotheworkthatIdo,becauseIcaresodeeplyaboutit.AndwhenI'mwithmykids,I'mgratefulforthat,butthenI'malsothinkingofallthethingsIneedtodoforwork.

Andso,wewerelike,we'regonnacreateaneventwherewecanhaveboth,andwecancelebrateboth,andwecanhavefamilytime.Andthebeautifulthingthat'sgrownoutofthatisourkidsnowhavetheseamazingfriendshipsaswell,andwehavetheseamazingfriendships.Buttruly,inthebeginning,wereallydidn'tknoweachotherandlikeyousaid,wedon'tsharethesamereligion,orthesamepoliticalviews,oranyofthat.

Andwhenwefirststartednoneofuslivedinthesamestate,andacoupleofthemdidn'tevenliveinthesamecountry.Andwewouldmakeapointtogettogethertwiceayear,andIthinkthat'ssomethingthat'simportanttokeepinmindisthatsometimesyoudohavetomaketheeffort.Thecommunityintoday'sworld,unfortunately,doesn'thappenasspontaneouslyasitoncedid.ButIthinkthatissomethingwereallydesperatelyneedtonurture.

AndIthinkotherculturesdoabetterjobofthis,likesobacktoTinawhorunstheprobiotic,she'sSerbian,andshetalkedabouthowintheircommunitytheybasicallyformlifelongrelationshipswithanotherfamily,orgroup.So,whentheygetmarried,thebestmanintheweddingiscalledtheKoom,andthenhebecomesthegodfatherofallthechildren,andhe'sinvolvedintheirlifethewholetime.So,youalwayshavethatpersonthatyouknowhasyourback.AndIthinkforsomanyofusthere'snotagiven...it'snotbuiltinlikethat,andsowehavetomakethechoicetobuilditin.ButIthinkthat'sthecorepointthatIkeepgoingbacktoiswehavetojustprioritizethatit'snotjustnecessarilygoingtohappen,andittakessometimesgoing,"Hey,you'remypeople.Let'sgettogether."

Heather:Yeah,andforus,itwasdefinitelyaprocess,likeyousaid,wedidn'tactuallyliveneareachotherwhenwereallydecidedthatwewereeachother'speople.Butovertime,literallyoveryearsnow,severalofthefamilieshavegravitatedtoamoreofalocalareasothatgettingtogetheriseasierandeasier.Andthenwe'remakingtheeffortwiththosewhoarestilllivingfurtheraway.Andmaybethatdoesn'tmakesenseforeveryone,butforus,becauseofthepassionsthatwesharedwehadsuchastrongcommonbondinoneareathatwejustdecidedtomakeitwork.

Butyeah,itwaskindofanevolutionwherewestarteddistantandthenphysicallocation,physicalcloseness,andbeingindailylifesharingmeals,notwheels,sharingmealsonamoreregularbasishasbecomelikemoreofanon-negotiable.Becauseit'sthedailyorweeklycommunitythatseemstohavethemostimpactonouroverallwell-being.Doyouwannatransitionintothetoppodcastthatyou'vedoneovertheselast...isit100episodes,andsomeofyourfavoritetakeawaysfromthere?Ordidyouwannaaddanythingonthecommunityaspect?

Katie:Yeah,Ithinklet'stransitionintothat.ThelastthingIwouldsayoncommunityisjustbewillingtobechallenged.Ithinkthat'ssomethingthatourlittlecommunityhasdonesuperwell,isthatbecausewedidn'talwaysagreeoneverything,butbecausewelovethesepeoplesomuch,wehadtoletourselvesbechallenged,andacceptthepossibilitythatmaybewe'renotrightabouteverything.AndIthinkwegrowaspeoplefromdoingthat.Onapersonallevel,I'vekindofspentthelasttwoyears...basically,ImadealistofeverythingIthoughtIbelievedandhavechallengedmyselfpointbypointonallofthose.BecauseIthinkit'soneofthosesituationswhereifyou'reright,thenyou'reonlygoingtostrengthenyourviewpointandhopefully,gainempathyforthepeoplewhomaychooseadifferentviewpoint.Andifyou'rewrong,ifthere'sahillyou'rewillingtodieonyouwannamakesureit'sahillworthdying.


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Andso,Ithinkacommunitydoesn'thavetobesolikehomogeneousthatitjustreinforcesourbeliefseither.Ithinksometimeschoosingourpeoplemeanschoosingpeoplethatchallengeusbecausethat'showwegrow.So,Ijustwantedtoleavethatoutthereaswell.Ifyoucan'tfindyourgroupofpeopleexactlylikeyouwhereveryoulive,findpeoplewhoaren't,butwhoarekind,orgenerous,orhavethatincommonandbuildfromthere.

ThispodcastisbroughttoyoubyFourSigmatic.There’ssomuchIloveaboutthiscompany,forinstancetheirfounder,Tero,forhimforagingandgrowinglocalfoodsisapassionthatgoesbackgenerationsasheisa13th-generationfarmerfromFinland,wheretheydothingsalittlebitdifferently.Terofoundawaytoincorporatehighlybeneficialsuperfoodmushroomsintoeverydaybeverageslikecoffee,matchaandsuperfoodelixirssowecanallsipthemeverydayandgetthemanybenefits.Forinstance,didyouknowthatoneservingofChagamushroomscontainsasmuchantioxidantsas30poundsofcarrots,andthatChagamushroomsareconsideredthemostantioxidantrichfoodonearthgramforgram?FourSigmaticcoffeehasbeenmygo-tooncoffeedaysforyearssinceithasbeneficialLionsManeorCordycepsforanextrabrainboostwithoutthejitters,andIconsumeoneoftheircoffeesorelixirseveryday.IalsooftenendthedaywiththeirReishiElixirwhichhelpspromoterestfulsleep.Youcancheckouttheirfullrangeofproductsandgraba15%discountbygoingtofoursigmatic.com/wellnessmamaandusingthecodewellnessmama.ThispodcastissponsoredbyThriveMarket…IhavebeenorderingfromThriveforyearsandsavinghundredsofdollarsayearbydoingso,becauseIliveabout20milesfromthenearestbig-ishcityandfrommostbiggrocerystores.IshoplocalforourproduceandmeatsofcoursebuttosavetimeandtrafficIgetmostofournon-perishablesfromThriveMarket.Everymonth,Iorderacoupleofbigboxesthathaveallofourstaplesforthemonthlikecondiments,almondbutter,grainfreecrackers,coconutaminos,spices,bakingingredients,plantainchips,maplesyrup,tomatoproducts,pastasauceandmore.SinceThriveislikeCostcomeetsWholeFoodsonline,thisallowsourfamilytosavealotofmoneyeachmonthandeachyear,whilealwaysbeingstockedonthefoodswelove.Justforlisteningtothispodcast,youcangetanextra25%offyourfirstorderplusafree30daymembershiptoThriveMarketatthrivemarket.com/katie.Katie:Yeah,let'sgoontothetopfiverecap,andthenremindingmyselftocomebacktothegratitudeexerciseattheveryendand...

Heather:IwasgonnaactuallymentionthatbecauseIrememberyousaidthatovercoffeethismorningandIwaslikeweshoulddefinitely,definitelytalkaboutthat.Allright,solet'stalkaboutsomeofthemostpopularpodcaststhathaveoccurredinthelast100episodes,andyourbiggesttakeawayfromthem.So,numberone,JimKwik.Tellusaboutthat?

Katie:Yeah,thisone,IknowsomanyofyouguyslovedandIlovedittoo.Jimwas...Ifeltlikeeverywordoutofhismouthwasquotable.Typically,ItrytothinkofacouplequoteswhileI'mrecordingandwritethemdownsothatwecanmakethemintoquotes.Andforhim,Ihadlikethreepagesofquotesthatwillcontinuetoshowuponsocialmediaforthenextyear,becauseitwasso,sogood.Buthesaidthingslike,"Ifknowledgeispowerthenlearningisasuperpower."Andthatforourkidsfacingthisworldtocome,orevenforusnow,wehavetobeabletobeadaptabletothinkcriticallyandtolearnquickly.Andsothat'sbeenhislifework.

ThebeautyofJimisthatheprovesit'spossiblebecausewhenhewasyoung,hehadlearningdisabilities,andittookhimalongtimetoread,andhewasn'tconsideredsmartinschool.Andheshareshisownstoryofhowbasically,like,readingthroughcomicbooks,andlikeseeingthesefiguresthatcouldgofrommoreshyorsheltered,likehowSuperman...hewasClarkKentinreallife.Orseeingthesepeoplewhoinreallifeweren'tsuperheroes,butthatsteppedupandbecamesuperheroesthatthatwaspartofhimlearninghowtohavehis


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ownsuperpower,whichnowisbeinganexpertinrapidlearning,andmemory,andteachingpeopletheseskills.Heeventeachesactorsandactresseshowtomemorizetheirlinesmorequicklyforparts.

ButJimsharesmypassionforthenextgenerationandforkids.Andthatwasthebeautyofthatpodcast,ishereallywentdeeponhowcanwesetourkidsupforsuccessinthefuture,andalsohowcanwemakesurethatwekeepourmindssharp,andwekeep,mostimportantly,advancingthegoodofcommunity,andthegoodofallofusbylearninganddialoguingandworkingtowardcommongoals.AndIreallylovethatepisodeforallthosereasons.

Heather:ThatremindsmeofaMarieForleoquotethatIcameacrossrecently,thatitwasn'ttheofficialtaglineofmychildhood,butwhenIkindaheardit,Iwaslike,"Butitwas,itjustwasn'tstated,"andthatwas"Everythingisfigureoutable."Youknow,thatwasthemindsetthatmymomhadwhensheraisedmysisterandI.Mydadpassedaway,hedidn't...SowhenI'minmyteens,shewasmyprimaryinfluence.Anditliterallydidn'tmatterwhatitwas,herresponsewas,"Everything'sfigureoutable.Wecanalwaysworkaroundorlearntheskillsthatweneedtomakethiswork."AnditdefinitelyiswhatItookintoadulthoodandI'msogratefulforthatlesson.Sothatisreallyawesome.

Katie:Yeah,andtothatnote,itremindsmeofanothergreatthingwe'vetakenfromourownlittlecommunity.Somefriendsofourssayitoverandoverandlikeit'sbecomeIthinkallofourfamilymotto’sis,"Weweremadetodohardthings."Andthoselittlethings,theybecomekindofrallyingcriesinyourownlife,inyourowncommunity.Andthat'sjustoneofthosebeautifulthingsthatwe'velearnedfromsomeoneinourcommunity.

Heather:Absolutely,thatisdefinitelyafamilymottoforus.Numbertwo,episode90,Dr.KellyBrogan.So,whatwasyourbigtakeawaythere?

Katie:So,thisisagreatonetogobackandlistentoifyouhaveanykindofhormoneissuesorespeciallyanxietyanddepression.WhatIloveaboutherissheissoincrediblywellresearchedandthoroughineverythingthatshedoes.Andshe'snotafraidtotheearlierpoint,toquestioneverything.So,shebreaksdownthestudiesandlooksatwhy,andwhat'sthemotivation,andhowdoesthisactuallycomeintoplayinrealhumanmodels.Andshetriestotakeaveryholisticapproach.So,shehas...asanMD,sheforyearsprescribeddifferenttypesofmedication,andthenresearchedherwayoutofthatbasically.

Soasadoctor,shewillnotprescribe,forinstance,birthcontroltoherpatients,becauseshenowunderstandsthehormonalcascadethathappens.Andsheseesthatlinkbetweenanxietyanddepressionlateron.So,Ijustfeellikeherapproachwasverytangibleandpractical.AndIhearfromsomanypeopleandIknowyoudoaswellwithanxietyanddepression.Andweknowthatmentalhealththingsareontherise,andIfeellikethisissomethingthatweoweittoallofustokeepaddressingandpushingforward,andlearningabout,andchallenging,becauserightnow,Ifeellikesomanyofthecommon...justthecommonprescriptionsforpeopleinthosesituationsarenoteffectiveandtherearepeoplewhoaretrulysuffering.Andso,Ilovedthatherapproachwasverypracticalandveryaction-oriented,andthatalsoverymuchfullofempathyandcompassion.Sheunderstandswhatpeoplearegoingthrough,she'shadherownstruggles,andsoshecomesfromaplaceoftrulytryingtohelppeopleworkthroughthat.

Heather:Ilovethat,becauseIthinkit'sonethingtosaythisisrightorthisiswrong,buttoreallysayIknowthatthere'srealsufferingthere.Let'slookathowwecanreallyalleviatethatfromaholisticperspectiveasawayofapproachingthis,iswhatwewerereallyneed.Man,IthinkIjusttookonesipofcoffeetoomuch.Let'sgoontoepisode169,EricRemensperger.


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Katie:So,ImetEricat"Paleof/x"lastyear,andIstartedtalkingtohim,andweliterallytalkedandgeekedoutforthreehoursonstudies.Andthat'swhenIknewIhadtohavehimonthepodcast.ButEricisreallycoolbecausehe'sactuallyalawyer,Ithinkhe'sprobablythefirstlawyerI'veeverinterviewedonthepodcast.Andhealsohadadvancedstagedreallyseriousprostate.Yes,prostatecancer,Ialwaystrytosaypancreas,butthat'snotright.Hehadprostatecancerandtookhis...sohe'sinthelegalside,thereasonhe'ssuchagreatlawyerisbecausehe'sagreatresearcherandhecanconnectthedots.

So,hebasicallytookthatsameapproachtohishealthandresearchedhowtogetbetter.Andtheinterestingthingwithhimishewasalreadydoingprettymuchallthethingsthatconventionallywouldmakeyouhealthy.Like,hetickedalltheboxes,hegotplentyofexercise,hegotsleep,heateacleandiet,hewasn'teatingsugar,hewasnoteatinginflammatoryfoods.HismorningsmoothiewasapparentlyevenmoredensethanBenGreenfield's,therewaslike40ingredientsinit,andhestillgotcancer.Andso,thisreallyledhimtoresearchwhydowegetcancer,andhowcanweundoit.Andhebasicallytooktheapproachthatalotofexpertshaveputforththatcancerisbasicallyametabolicdisease,thatthereis...likeonacellularlevelthere'sthingsgoingonthatyouhavetoaddresssothatthebodycanrecover,andifyoudothatthebodywillbounceback.

Soheusedamixtureofhyperbarictherapy,vitaminCinhighdoses,ozonetherapyinIVan,fasting,andtherewereseveralotherthingshedid.Andhecompletelyreversedhisadvancedstagecancer.Andweknowstatisticallythatcancersareprettymuchontheriseacrosstheboard,sotherewasalottolearnfromhisexperience.

Heather:Oneinterestingnote,Iactuallyhadtheopportunitytoeatdinnerwithhimandawholegroupofotherpeoplerecently.Andsojustsomethingthattiesintoourpodcasttodayisthatcommunityisactuallyoneofthethingsthathe'sdoingamazinglywellat.Ithinkwomen,weareawarenowthatcommunityisimportant,butIthinkevenmenaren'tactuallyoftenmuchmoreofadifficultsituation.Vulnerabilityisconsideredsoinappropriate,Iguess,Idon'tknowwhattherightwordis,it'ssotabooforsomanygroupsofmen.

Butwhathehasdoneishehasagroupofmen,andtheyrangeinages,liketherearesomeyoungguys,therearesomeolderguys,they'rekindofatallstagesinlife.Buttheyshowup,isitlikeonceamonth,andtheyreallydolikegettingvulnerable.Andtheyhavesomespecificcriteriathatthey'restickingtoinordertoreallybegoodfriendstoeachother.AndIthoughtthatwasamazingbecause,youknow,youtalkaboutallthethingsthathe'sdoing,butthat'ssomethingthathefeelsisworthinvestinghistimein.

Katie:Yeah,Ithinkthat'sagreatpoint,andI'msogladyourememberedthat.Becausehesaidthattoointhepodcastthathethinksthatisactuallyoneofthebiggerkeysofwhyhegotbetter.Andhe,likeus,hehadtobereallyintentionalaboutthatandjustpicksomepeople,andbelike,"Heyyou'remypeople,let'sgettogetheronceamonth."AndfromwhatI'veheard,obviouslyIhaven'tbeentoit,it'saguy'sgroup,buttheytalkaboutvulnerablethings,andtheyleteachotherbevulnerable.So,Ithinkhe'saperfectexampleofthat.

Heather:Allright,let'sgoontoepisode163,TerofromFourSigmatic.Man,IrememberwhenyoufirstsharedthiscopywithmeandIwaslike."Wait,"becauseIhadalittleoneatthemoment.AndIwas...notsuperlittle,buttoddler,andIwaslike,"Youcanjustcarrycoffeeinyourpurseandmixitwithwater,like,foremergencies,ormeltdowns,orwhatever,bestthingever."Butit'smorethanthat,soIwouldlovetohearwhatyourbiggesttakeawaywasfromthatinterview.

Katie:Forsure,I'veactuallypassedoutsomuchFourSigmaticthislastweekbecauseit'sallinthesepouchesandit'sinstant,andyoucanmixitactuallywithhotorcoldwater.Andsopeoplewhoare...theydon'thave


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electricityorrunningwater,there'ssomanybeneficialpropertiestothesemushrooms,whichisoneofthethingsthatTerotalkedaboutinthisepisode.ButI'vebeenpassingouttheChagaandthecordyceps,andthesemushroomsthathaveantioxidantproperties,andanti-bacterial,andanti-viral,justforthesepeoplewhoaregoingthroughalotofstressandhavecompromisedimmunesystemsrightnow.

Andalso,ofcourse,thecoffeeonesthatareinstant,thatcanbemixedwithwaterwhenyoucan'tmakecoffeeinthemorning.Justthatalone,Ithinkhelpspeoplesomuchjustwhenyouhavenothingandthenyougetacupofcoffeeinthemorning,that'slikeonethingthatusedtobeaconstantinyourlife.It'sbeenamazingtoseelikejustthatlittlepickmeupcanmakesuchabigdifferenceforpeopleintheirdailylives.ButI'vebeenafanofusingmedicinalmushroomsorbasicallyculinarymushroomsinamedicinalwayforalongtime.AndthemoreI'velearnedthemoreIfeellikethat...So,Teroreallywentdeeponallthemainmushroomsthatyoucanusefordifferentbenefitsandhowtheywork.

Andso,everythingfromChaga,whichisthemostgramforgramantioxidant-richsubstanceontheplanet.Sobyweightandvolume,it'sifyou...Ithinkit'soneservingofChagahasasmuchantioxidantas30poundsofcarrots,orlikeseveralpoundsofblueberries.It'sdrasticallyhighinantioxidants,it'salsodelicious.HetalksaboutLion'sManeandhowthatactuallythey'refindingitcanpromoteneurogenesisinthebrain.So,thedevelopmentofnewneuralpathwaysandimprovementsinthebrain.Andthere'sactuallyclinicalstudieshappeningonthatrightnowforpeoplewithbraininjuries,orAlzheimer's,orevenjustthosetryingtokeepasharpmindastheyage.

AndothermushroomslikeReishiwhichhasgottenalotofpublicitylatelyforitsabilitytoinfluencetheparasympatheticnervoussystem,andtopromoterestfulsleep.Andso,hejustreallyexplainsallofthosereallywell.AndIwillsay,Ijustrecordedanotheronewithhim,sokeepanearouttowardChristmas.AfascinatingepisodeabouthowalotofthetraditionsweassociatewithSantaClausactuallygobacktohishomecountryofFinland,andespeciallythenorthernregioncalledLaplandandwherethosecomefrom.So,itanswersquestionslikewhySantawearsred,orhasapointyhat,orcomesdownachimney,sokeepanearoutforthatone.

Heather:Yeah,hetoldmealittlebitaboutthatrecently,itwasveryinteresting.Allright,wehaveonemore,andthisoneissomethingthat'sbeenonbothofourradarandourheartsforyearsnow.Andthat'sepisode161onsextrafficking.Whatwasyourbiggesttakeawayfromthatpodcast?

Katie:Yeah,thiswasatoughonebutalsoabeautifulone.Itwasveryilluminatingasfarasthestatisticsandrealizingthatweoftenthinkwe'resosafeespeciallyintheU.S.andwe'refacingthisatareallydrasticlevel.IwasinterviewingpeoplefromanorganizationcalledOperationUndergroundRailroad,andtheirwebsiteisourrescueO-U-RescueIbelieve.YoucanGoogleit,buttheytalkedaboutwhywehavesuchaproblemandwhereit'sstemmingfrom.Buttheyalsogavewaysthatwecanallworktokeepourkidsandourcommunitiessafe,soevenifwedon'thavekids,howwecankeepourcommunitysafe.

Andtheyhaveafreecourse,it'sbasicallyatrainingonhowtolookoutforthesignsofsextrafficking,andwhatwecanalldoaboutit.Becausethisissuchabigproblemthatmanyofusdon'tevenrealize.AndonethingIlovedaboutthisepisodeis...becauseyouandI,ofcourse,havetalkedaboutoverprotectedchildhoodandhowit'ssoimportantthatkidsgettoplayoutside.Andsooften,wehearfrompeoplewhodon'twanttheirkidstoplayoutsideorroamoutside,becausetheyworryaboutthembeingkidnapped,or,youknow,beingabducted.Andthat'saveryrealconcern,obviously,thatwasactuallysomethingthatwasthatwashappeningwewouldwanttomakesurethatdidn'thappen.


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Butonethingtheyreallyhammeredhomeinthatepisodewasthatjustbasedonthestatistics,theoddsofyourkidgettingkidnappedinyourfrontyardaresolowthatessentiallyachildwouldneedtostandtherefor750,000yearstogetkidnappedintheirfrontyard.Whereastheoddsaremuch,muchgreateronsocialmedia.AndsothatreallystuckouttomebecauseIfeellikesooften,wearekeepingkidsinsidetokeepthemsafe,andasaresult,they'reonscreens,andonphones,andontablets,andonsocialmediamore.Andthatwasacommonalitytheyfoundfrom,like,somanyofthevictimsthatthey'rerescuing,isthattheyhadbeentargetedonsocialmedia.

Andso,it'sagoodreminderasaparenttomakesurethatwe'rebeingvigilantandteachingourkidsgoodskills,makingsurethere'sopencommunication,andreallymonitoringhowthey'reinteractingonlinebecausetheysaidthat'swheretherealdangeris.It'snotinouryardsorneighborhoodsinmostcases,ofcourse,thereareexceptions,butmostofthetime,it'sintheonlineworldthatwereallyneedtobecareful.

Heather:Certainlyinteresting.SohereIam,I'mgonnacirclebacktosomethingthatwetalkedaboutovercoffeetoday.AndIfeellikeitistheperfectwaytowrapuptoday'sSaunacastbecausewe'rebothlike...we'remeltinghere,butIjustthinkitreallytiestogethereverything.ImeanI'msogratefultodayforthelast200episodes,everything,allthewisdomthat'sbeenshared,andalltheamazingtakeawaysthatsomanypeoplehavesharedwithus.Andalso,justinourownlivesforcommunityandeverything.ButyoumentionedsomethingtodaythatIthinkyoushouldmaybewalkusthroughagainaswewrapup.

Katie:Yeah,thiswassomethingthatcameupinaveryrealwaywhenwewereallinthathotelafewhoursawaywaitingtoseeifitwasgonnaactuallybeourreality.Butitwasjustagratitudeexercisetoremindusjusthowfortunateweallare.Becausetruly,ifyou'relisteningtothis,youhavesomuchmorethanmostpeopleintheworld,butit'seasytoforgetthatbecauseofthebusynessoflifeandallthatgoeson.Andso,theexercisebasicallyistocloseyoureyesforasecondandimaginethatyoutrulyhavenothing,andnotlikeyoudon'thaveallthepossessionsthatyouwishyouhad.Butlike,youhavenoclothes,thereisnolight,youarecold,youhavenofood,youarehungry,there'snobathroom,there'snorunningwater,there'snobed,youtrulyhavenothing,andjusttositwiththatforasecondofwhatthatfeelslike.

Becausetherearepeopleherenearusthatareprettyclosetothat,thankfully,mostofthemhaveclothesandwe'retryingreallyhardtobringthemfood.Butalotofthemdon'thaveshelter,andtheydon'thaverunningwater,andtheydon'thaveelectricity.Sojustsitwiththatandfeelwhatthatwouldfeellike.Somanyofushavenevergratefullyhadtoactuallyfeelthat,butalotofpeopledo.Andso,tofeelthatfeelingforaminuteandthentoimaginethatsomeonegaveyouashelterevenifitwasatentoraroofoveryourhead.Andsomeonegaveyouclothesjusttohavesomethingonyourbodyandhowgratefulthatwouldfeelifyouonlyhadthosethings.

Andthenimaginethatsomeonerestoredpowertothatshelterthatyouhad,andtherewasrunningwater,andevenplumbing,whichsomanypeopleintheworldstilldon'thave.Andhowmucheasieryourlifewouldgetjustfromthosethings,evenifyouhadnothingelse.Andthenimagineonebyoneallthecomfortsthatwehaveinreallife,thewarmbedsthatwesleepin,andmorethanjustoneclothingoption,andaccesstofood,andaccesstocleanwater,andevenaccesstoentertainment,andgettingtowatchmoviesandseefriends,andtoplaygames,andhavepossessionsthatarejustpurelythereforenjoyment.

Andjustareminderofallthosethingsinlifethatwecanbegratefulfor,because,tosomedegree,Ifeellikethat'salessonwebothgotalittlebitofinthelastweekthatI'msogratefulfor,ishavingtomentallygotoaplacewhereyourealizeallthosethingscouldbegone.Andthengettoactuallycomehometothem.It'slikegettingthembackasagift.Andso,Ithinkthatcirclesbacktotheoriginalpointaboutcommunity,andothers


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asjusthavingthatgratitudeforallthesomanywonderfulthingswehaveinlife,andbeingwillingtosharethem,withouttherehavingtobeadisastertomakethathappen.

AndIthinkthere'safittingquote,Idon'tknowifyouwannareaditordoyouwantmetoreadit?ButfromBrenéBrownwhowe'vetalkedaboutsomanytimestoday,justontheimportanceofcommunity,andIthinkit'saperfectfittingintothispodcast.

Heather:Yeah,shewrites,"Adeepsenseofloveandbelongingisanirresistibleneedofallpeople.Wearebiologically,cognitively,physically,andspirituallywiredtolove,tobeloved,andtobelong.Whenthoseneedsarenotmet,wedon'tfunctionasweweremeantto.Webreak,wefallapart,wenumb,weache,wehurtothers,wegetsick."

Katie:So,Ithinkthat'saperfectplacetowrapup.And,likeIoftensay,thankyouguyssomuchforlisteningandforsharingyourtimeintheselast200episodeswithus.Ifanyofyouguyswantmoredetailonthehurricanereliefeffortsandwhatwe'redoingonthegroundhere,checkouttheshownotesatwellnessmama.fm.Iwilllinktoawaythatyoucangetsuppliesandhelpdirectlytothoseofuswhoaretryingtohelptheseindividualpeopleinneed.Butdefinitely,pleasekeepusallinyourthoughtsandprayers,assomanypeopledownhererebuild.Andwehopethatyouwillconsiderinwhateverwaypossibleinyourlife,findingwaystobuildandnurturecommunityinlittlewayseveryday.Andthankyouforlistening.

Ifyou'reenjoyingtheseinterviews,wouldyoupleasetaketwominutestoleavearatingorreviewoniTunesforme?Doingthishelpsmorepeopletofindthepodcast,whichmeansevenmoremomsandfamiliescouldbenefitfromtheinformation.Ireallyappreciateyourtime,andthanksasalwaysforlistening.

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Episode 200: Most Important Thing for Health With Heather ... › wm.podcast... · founder, Tero, for him foraging and growing local foods is a passion that goes back generations